Matty Should Side with the Onions

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craig		#21	[-]
Posts: 14263 (11/09/08 12:51 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	How is Corinne unfriendly to Matty? (asie from loyalty to an alliance that has been reduced from 6 to 4) She'd probably be happy to go after Susie and Crystal, and leave Ken (who he has some tenuous relationship with) alone. As for ad hominem attacks, I notice most people who argue the opposite are Kenny\Crystal fans, so it evens out. It's Matty who is the swing vote now, so that's why I discuss the choice from his perspective. Do people here read the Insider and remember what a raving irrational bitch Crystal was to Matty last epsisode? Crystal Insults Matty As the tension at Fang comes to a head, Crystal has a talk with Matty at the dock Crystal: Wassup? Matty: I don't know. What are you talking about, wassup? Crystal: What's today? Matty: Day 20. Crystal: You can't tell you've changed from day 1 to day 20? Matty: Of course I've changed. Everybody's changed. How have I changed? Crystal: Matty, you've turned into some evil Dr. Hyde. Matty: I have? Why do you say that? Crystal: I know it's not fun, winning or losing, you know, and us going on this evil, this losing streak. It's like since Ace has been in this camp you've changed, and you don't believe me, look at yourself from day 1, Matty. Your whole thing out here, "I wanna see Jamie, I wanna see Jamie." You know what, Matty? I'm gonna be real with you. Real outside of this game and in real life. You mess me and Kenny over, karma is a bitch. Trust me on this. It's ridiculous. You have turned into some evil person. Matty: How have I turned into an evil person? Crystal: Just by things you're doing and you're saying. Matty: Like what? Name it. Crystal: Just...a lot of stuff has not been called for. Matty: Name it. Crystal: When it comes to me, I'll... Matty: Name it! Crystal: When it comes to me, I'll let you know. Matty: Let me know right now, if it's... Crystal: When it comes to me, I'll let you know. Matty: You're gonna make a statement so grand, that I'm evil. Back it up. Back it up. Crystal: You've just turned into a mean person. From day 1 you were like the guy from Cali, the cool sufer guy from Cali. Now you've just turned into some cutthroat person that's just mean. Matty: How am I mean? Name it. You can't make a statement if you can't back it. Try. Why are you gonna make a statement that you can't back? Crystal: I can't give any specifics right now. Matty: Then why did you wake up this morning with the urge to rouse me and bring me down to the dock. Crystal: I apologize. I even apologize for wasting your time. I apologize. I apologize for wasting your time. Last Edited By: craig 11/09/08 1:24 AM. Edited 1 times.
JaMalle		#22	[-]
Posts: 4300 (11/09/08 1:00 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	hehe nice Craig. I'd hope that even the Crystal fans aren't trying to say that she isn't irrational and crazy, because if so, they're the ones that are delusional... Anyway, Crystal <3 but like I said, it's a ahrd toss up. I think the key for Matty will be picking off Susie and Bob/Charlie, effectively keeping both sides vying for his loyalty instead of focusing on him as an immunity threat.
mfrimley		#23	[-]
Posts: 901 (11/09/08 1:23 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	So what if Crystal is a raving, irrational bitch? We get that she's too big, too black, and too intimidating for you to root for, but she seemed alot more willing to work with Matty than Corinne, even after he tried to get rid of her. Because of one conversation where Crystal was probably delirious from starvation, Matty should ditch the people he's known since day 1 for a bunch of strangers, in the desperate, totally unfounded hope that they'll use somebody they don't even know as a substitution for Marcus? The only onion Matty has any relationship with is Randy, and he wanted to throw the immunity challenge just to get rid of him. It's asinine.
Kirblar		#24	[-]
Posts: 6906 (11/09/08 1:32 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Crystal's crazy, but she's not irrational.
JaMalle		#25	[-]
Posts: 4301 (11/09/08 2:40 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	well when I mean irrational, I mean her behavior and lack of forseight when acting out. Don't get me wrong, Crystal is trying hard to understand the game, and she understands the basics, but when you have as many outbursts as she's had, I would call that irrational. And hey, maybe it's just simply coincidence that Craig is racist and loves only cute white girls/people. LOL just kidding of course!! Craig knows I love him.
James Barber		#26	[-]
Posts: 14530 (11/09/08 3:09 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	If the Onions go after Matty next week, then he probably won't have much choice but to work against them (and continue to do so if he survives to a merge). If they don't, then he may be better off going with them. Crystal and Ken tend to vote off the strong, athletic players at first opportunity. They won't have any need for Matty after a few votes, and would probably dump him. It's better for him to find a position where he won't be so disposable, where he could fit into either group or work as a swing.
mfrimley		#27	[-]
Posts: 902 (11/09/08 5:04 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Crystal and Ken tend to vote off the strong, athletic players at first opportunity. They won't have any need for Matty after a few votes, and would probably dump him. You could say the same thing about the onion since they booted Dan instead of Susie, and see Matty as a physical threat. Getting rid of Ace and Marcus were the most obvious moves for Kenstal, and were all about protecting their alliance. You shouldn't stereotype Ken as somebody with a revenge of the nerds kind of agenda just because he's a little Asian guy. They could have gotten rid of Matty a long time ago, and from what Matty told Ace, he and Ken were tight. Even after Matty tried to vote out Crystal, she was diplomatic and offered him a clean slate, in stark contrast to Corinne's psychotic episode after Susie dared to even hint she might vote for her. If anybody has earned Matty's loyalty, it's the Fangs. The onion has done nothing but plot against him. If they get desperate enough to offer him a deal now, they're probably just bullshitting.
Genesis		#28	[-]
Posts: 40 (11/09/08 6:23 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	craig wrote: How is Corinne unfriendly to Matty? (asie from loyalty to an alliance that has been reduced from 6 to 4) She'd probably be happy to go after Susie and Crystal, and leave Ken (who he has some tenuous relationship with) alone. As for ad hominem attacks, I notice most people who argue the opposite are Kenny\Crystal fans, so it evens out. It's Matty who is the swing vote now, so that's why I discuss the choice from his perspective. Do people here read the Insider and remember what a raving irrational bitch Crystal was to Matty last epsisode? Crystal Insults Matty As the tension at Fang comes to a head, Crystal has a talk with Matty at the dock Crystal: Wassup? Matty: I don't know. What are you talking about, wassup? Crystal: What's today? Matty: Day 20. Crystal: You can't tell you've changed from day 1 to day 20? Matty: Of course I've changed. Everybody's changed. How have I changed? Crystal: Matty, you've turned into some evil Dr. Hyde. Matty: I have? Why do you say that? Crystal: I know it's not fun, winning or losing, you know, and us going on this evil, this losing streak. It's like since Ace has been in this camp you've changed, and you don't believe me, look at yourself from day 1, Matty. Your whole thing out here, "I wanna see Jamie, I wanna see Jamie." You know what, Matty? I'm gonna be real with you. Real outside of this game and in real life. You mess me and Kenny over, karma is a bitch. Trust me on this. It's ridiculous. You have turned into some evil person. Matty: How have I turned into an evil person? Crystal: Just by things you're doing and you're saying. Matty: Like what? Name it. Crystal: Just...a lot of stuff has not been called for. Matty: Name it. Crystal: When it comes to me, I'll... Matty: Name it! Crystal: When it comes to me, I'll let you know. Matty: Let me know right now, if it's... Crystal: When it comes to me, I'll let you know. Matty: You're gonna make a statement so grand, that I'm evil. Back it up. Back it up. Crystal: You've just turned into a mean person. From day 1 you were like the guy from Cali, the cool sufer guy from Cali. Now you've just turned into some cutthroat person that's just mean. Matty: How am I mean? Name it. You can't make a statement if you can't back it. Try. Why are you gonna make a statement that you can't back? Crystal: I can't give any specifics right now. Matty: Then why did you wake up this morning with the urge to rouse me and bring me down to the dock. Crystal: I apologize. I even apologize for wasting your time. I apologize. I apologize for wasting your time. Are you serious? This was right after Matty started irrationally backstabbing her to side with Ace, so how is Crystal the "raving irrational bitch" here?
James Barber		#29	[-]
Posts: 14531 (11/09/08 7:23 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	You could say the same thing about the onion since they booted Dan instead of Susie, and see Matty as a physical threat. Getting rid of Ace and Marcus were the most obvious moves for Kenstal, and were all about protecting their alliance. You shouldn't stereotype Ken as somebody with a revenge of the nerds kind of agenda just because he's a little Asian guy. The Onions had a number of other concerns about Dan which didn't involve his physical strength. If they work with Matty, they'll need his vote and probably won't turn against him for most of the game. Ken and Crystal will cease to need Matty after a few votes. Matty also has no real ties to anyone in Ken/Crystal/Susie, whereas he at least has some to Randy and Sugar. I never said that Ken's voting decisions were based on him being a little Asian guy. I base them on the history from him as well as from Crystal. Ken chose to align with extremely weak players. Crystal's been pushing to get rid of strong players since the start. If it had been up to Crystal, Dan would have gone right after Michelle, even though that would have meant so much useless baggage left on Fang. Crystal and Ken were never in an alliance with Matty until necessity forced them together, and since Crystal sees Matty as evil and mean (even before he voted against her), she's going to have a hard time wanting him to stay around.
mfrimley		#30	[-]
Posts: 904 (11/09/08 3:05 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Your arguments are weak. There's no way you can speak for the onion and speculate that they wouldn't turn against Matty. They've shown by the way they've strung along Bob that they're willing to use people and lie about their actual place in the pecking order. If it's strictly a matter of needing Matty's vote, then at this point, he should side with Fang, since there are only three of them. The onion is a foursome, so they need his vote less, and will be in a position to safely dispose of him sooner. This whole discussion is probably pointless anyway if there isn't a merge next ep. Once the onions on Fang see that Marcus is gone, they'll realize that winning immunity will mean losing Bob, so unless it's another one of those non-team challenges, they'll probably throw it to get rid of Matty.
SPunKeeMonKee		#31	[-]
Posts: 11270 (11/09/08 5:21 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Crystal and Ken tend to vote off the strong, athletic players at first opportunity That's because these "strong, athletic players" were going after them first.. I don't think they see Matty that way because they were loosely aligned with him at some point.
James Barber		#32	[-]
Posts: 14532 (11/09/08 6:28 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	That's because these "strong, athletic players" were going after them first. Dan wasn't going after Crystal when she wanted him out. I don't think Michelle was either. Jacquie was going after Kelly (then they got rid of Kelly only a few episodes later, so there never was much point in keeping her). . There's no way you can speak for the onion and speculate that they wouldn't turn against Matty. We're all speculating, aren't we? The onion is a foursome If Sugar goes back to Fang, then Susie/Crystal/Ken/Sugar will be a foursome. They will also be a foursome who know they can't win most of the challenges, so they will be much more motivated to get rid of a potential big challenge threat like Matty as soon as they have an opportunity.
mfrimley		#33	[-]
Posts: 905 (11/09/08 6:41 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Some of us are speculating, others are advocating for their pet players. I'm on the record saying that Matty will be a target sooner or later no matter who he sides with. It's in no one's best interests to let him coast to the end.
James Barber		#34	[-]
Posts: 14535 (11/09/08 6:46 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Some of us are speculating, others are advocating for their pet players. The only player I liked very much this season was Dan, and he's gone. I think strategically, aligning with Ken/Crystal/Susie is a very risky choice (just ask most of their former allies), and there's more to be gotten from working with the Onions.
SPunKeeMonKee		#35	[-]
Posts: 11273 (11/09/08 6:49 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	^ When did Crystal say she was going after Dan? Do you mean when they were speculating about him having the idol? It wasn't just her and it definitely wasn't because she wanted to get a strong guy out of the game. I think the editing played up a small coversation and blew it up to create suspense. As for Michelle, her horrible attitude was enough to make everyone want her gone (not just Ken & Crystal). Jacquie had to go because she was a great social player, they were able to tell she wasn't being genuine. I understand you don't like them but you should be able to see that every vote they cast is done to protect their alliance and not because they have some sort of grudge against athletic players. Matty is screwed either way but he'd be better off siding with people whose behaviour he can predict and can be beaten in immunity challenges. It's as simple as that.
mfrimley		#36	[-]
Posts: 906 (11/09/08 7:27 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Was that the same conversation where Matty said he doesn't trust anybody in a suit? That doesn't bode well for Charlie.
chapera rocks		#37	[-]
Posts: 9812 (11/09/08 8:25 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	The one thing I can see questionable about Crystal/Kenny's gameplay is getting rid of GC and Kelly. But even then, it bought them Sugar's loyalty. Right now Matty has Sugar with him. So, he really has no reason to jump over to the onions given that 1) he doesn't trust them, 2) he had a feeling they were going to throw the challenge per insider, 3) he knows Corinne/Charlie/Randy are a strong threesome now, where as Crystal/Kenny appear to be the only solid alliance within NuFang atm.
James Barber		#38	[-]
Posts: 14537 (11/09/08 8:54 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	chapera rocks wrote: The one thing I can see questionable about Crystal/Kenny's gameplay is getting rid of GC and Kelly. But even then, it bought them Sugar's loyalty. She doesn't seem very loyal to Ken at the moment. If he's lucky, she won't have anywhere else to go. Was that the same conversation where Matty said he doesn't trust anybody in a suit? Since Matty went on to make an alliance with Dan, he must have changed his mind at some point. Crystal never did. Matty is screwed either way but he'd be better off siding with people whose behaviour he can predict and can be beaten in immunity challenges. It's as simple as that. I think Ken/Crystal are the least predictable players left. I never would have predicted that they would have been gotten rid of Kelly and GC before Ace, especially since Kelly would have voted with them every single time. Matty being able to beat them in immunity challenges is exactly why he's such a threat to them.
Kirblar		#39	[-]
Posts: 6915 (11/09/08 9:13 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	GC quit. His boot ep reeked of the weirdness we saw last season with Johnny Fairplay and Chet's boots. I would guess that they believed that if they kept him, he would quit, taking two of their members out of the game.
James Barber		#40	[-]
Posts: 14540 (11/09/08 9:21 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Kirblar wrote: GC quit. His boot ep reeked of the weirdness we saw last season with Johnny Fairplay and Chet's boots. I would guess that they believed that if they kept him, he would quit, taking two of their members out of the game. All they had to do was tell GC that they respected his decision, and could he please vote for Ace instead of any of them. Then they could have also voted for Ace. If he didn't like it, he could have quit right after Ace left. Ken said he had risked his life from the start to get rid of Ace, but I think that was a very obvious way to get rid of Ace that they overlooked. Maybe they asked GC and he refused to vote for Ace, I don't know. Jenna and Heidi refused to let Shawna quit, instead they voted out Joanna, who was a big thorn in their side. I couldn't stand Jenna in that season, but she made the right decision and it paid off for her.

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