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astroline |
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I didn't think Corinne was N either, but FLF really nailed it 100%, awesome job as usual!
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getting real |
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I agree that Corinne wasn't N.
I get the feeling that the editors will have a relatively easy job if and when they wish to apply the negative brushstrokes. Conversely, I also get the feeling that they must be having a devil of a job preventing a negative tone, if that is their intention. Her gender is one obstacle (sadly, strong, assertive women tend to catch people unaware and thus tend to elicit negative responses); her demeanour is another. I think if an under/over market was framed about how many smiles she cracks during the entire series, it wouldn't be set at much more than three. Randy, too, for that matter. Notwitstanding all of that, she remains one of the few with winning chances. I'm not concerned about visibility - yet. She remains my top pick. |
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Jedijake |
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Agreed-Corinne is not N, not at this point.
Sure, she said she didn't like too many people on her tribe (or something like that), but maybe that's fuel for later, not now. Todd said something like that too, albeit much later on in the season. |
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Phoenix1269 |
Updated MORD stuff | ||
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just an fyi... i have updated the MOR Differential list for E/E2 this morning.
Michelle's MOR Diff Season averages were calculating incorrectly. I have fixed the calculation on the spreadsheet (she should not have had values after E1, but she did... fixed now!) Thank you very much OTH for catching this!!! Updated MOR Diff & Season Averages for E1/E2 |
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Phoenix1269 |
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Fang Tribe
Crystal MORP2 Dan UTR1 GC MORN2 Ken UTR1 Matty UTR1 Randy MORM3 Susie INV Kota Tribe Ace CPN4 Bob MOR2 Charlie MOR2 Corinne CP5 Jacquie INV Kelly UTRN1 Marcus MOR2 Paloma OTTN4 Sugar CPP5 Elim: Kelly, Paloma, Jacquie, Susie Seriously Unlikely: Sugar, Dan, GC, Ken, Matty I haven't elimated just yet: Ace, Bob, Crystal Possibly: Charlie, Randy Likely Winning: Marcus, Corinne sorry - no comments this time... life has been hectic the last several days, but i will say that i am not convinced that Ace is OTTN... i think of Natalie from last year with her villanous finger tapping when i think OTTN, and i just didn't see that, maybe a MOR Is better here? Also don't think sugar id OTTP yet...we really learned a lot about her - got inside her head regarding they whys for playing and what she is expecting to get out of the game. Maybe not strategy, but definitely well developed person. I also went back and forth on kelly... i think she was inteneded to look Dumb by the editors, but i'm not sure if that = negative. I decided that between that TC fiasco and that she was conected heavily to Negative Nellie Paloma... that she defaults to N... but her vis is so low, it's weird, but. |
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Phoenix1269 |
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just a quick reminder...
please have your votes submitted today by 7:00 pm MST THANK YOU |
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astroline |
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You got mine right, Phoenix? Thanks again for all your work, you're awesome.
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MasterDarkNinja |
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Here's my ratings, you can view the strategy chart/notes on page 1. I put in a note about Paloma being a debatable + for you in the notes section Kitty.
Winners List
-Ace (INV ep#2, getting a very N edit) -GC (WAY too visible when he really didn't have to be) -Jacquie (INV = death) -Kelly (INV = death) -Ken (INV = death) -Paloma (INV = death) -Sugar (INV = death) -Susie (Too ignored early on) Nearly Eliminated -Dan (Feels like a boring nobody the editors don't care about) -Matty (Feels like a boring nobody the editors don't care about) -Randy (Just seems like a N distraction, the negative guy who's always right) Poor -Crystal (She just seems like a distraction to me, always shown reacting to the short term stuff, never anything long term)Unsure -Bob (The bad thing for him is his near INV in part 2, if those episodes weren't back to back I'd have probably given him an INV there and thrown him down at least one catagory) Decent -Charlie (Definitely not OTTish this episode, he's starting to remind me of a toned down version of Todd somewhat now) -Corinne (She gets more meaningful editing then Jacquie) -Marcus (Kind of sat back and wasn't too memorable this episode, but wasn't quite UTR either)
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AllMenAreIslands |
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flf, I wouldn't give Dan a P. He got neg SPV from Sugar with respect to not being able to find the II at Exile Is. Although he wasn't mentioned by
name, he was definitely alluded to ("the lawyer"). Everyone knows who she was talking about. I'd say the neg SPV would reduce him to 'no
tone' or mixed. But at UTR1 viz, it hardly matters lol.
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fat little fingers |
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OTH:My "too visible and too aggressive to be the winner" refers to her edit as a female winner. If she is our winner, she's the most aggressive woman ever to win. At this point, I'm ignoring her gender for the content and her opening ep still works the best, with some reservations about her possible role as the winner's adversary. Oh, and it should be noted that her first hour was a very UTR edit. Given her content and scenes, I'd call it "hidden". astro:Thanks,astro, but... yep, just like I nailed Scout, Ozzy, and Amanda. Awesome. Lol. I cheer for the underdogs to my usual regret. I cheered for the Boston Red Sox, until they won the Series and are now just another arrogant bunch of rich baseball players. (Lol. I'm still a BoSox fan, though the magic is over for now.) About Ace's rating: I can see the argument for Ace being Complex rather than OTT, I can even understand an M rather than an N. But, I think the intention was to show him as completely unaware that he is on everyone's radar. Rather, he talks to Sugar about how they can control the boots with the HI. That plus the negative comments from Paloma, Bob, Corinne, and Charley equals OTTN to me. Jacquie: I wouldn't fight an INV for Jacquie. She gets a quick naming as part of the alliance at the beginning of the ep. But she has zero story after that. Still at this point INV and UTR1 have the same effect on her status. (Unless she won. Lol) Phoenix and OTH, thanks for the work done on the MORdif! Super appreciated. If we take the fang members out of the MORdif now, we have Marcus, Charley, and Corinne closest to the middle of the edit after the opening two hours. eta: AMAI: I agree and said in my post that maybe he should get an N for Sugar's dig.
Last Edited By: fat little fingers
10/05/08 2:29 PM.
Edited 1 times.
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AllMenAreIslands |
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flf, I think GC was a much more OTTN type of edit than Ace's. I disagree that Ace being shown as unaware is the same as being one-dimensional.
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AllMenAreIslands |
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Here are my ratings.
Ace CPN4 Bob MOR2 Charlie MOR3 Corinne CPN4 Crystal UTR3 - note that I use UTR because she was shown a lot. Not much speaking time relative to the amount of time shown onscreen. Dan UTR1 Danny OTTN2 - lots of neg SPV. He's turned into a caricature. Jacquie INV Jessica ("Sugar") CPP4 Kelly UTR1 Winner picks: Marcus, Corinne, Ken (mostly picking Ken because I like him, he doesn't have much chance really.) Ken UTR2 Marcus UTR2 Matty UTR1 Paloma CPN4 Randy MORNN3 - he's gonna be OTT if he keeps it up. Susie INV |
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panurge46 |
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While Kota is showing signs of looking to the end game, Fang is still marred in their present sorry state. The important tribe is Kota and the winner should
be in their present ranks:
Kelly (UTR1)
Jacquie (INV1)
Ken (UTR1)
GC (MORN2)
Crystal: (MORP2)
Bob (MOR2)
Randy (MORN3)
For now, I see 3: Marcus (MORN3)
Corinne (CP4)
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OnlyTheHunter |
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Phoenix did all the work, I just caught that something was off with the past tally. Thanks Phoenix for the quick fix.
Love the commerical just aired on CBS. If you don't want to know, quit reading now. Definitely picking new tribes, a shake up is coming. And blonde vs blonde vs blonde. You know what that means...Kelly gets 4 sentences this week! Michael |
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fat little fingers |
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Panurge, a response to your winner comments (because they're good and they're detailed.)
Ace: I think the 2 hour premier was simply two eps joined together. But, it looks to be just a technical disagreement, since we agree his chances at best are very low. Marcus: Yes, his tear-wipe was the most disrespectful gesture of TC. Corinne's sideways look at Sugar had some justification in that Sugar did hold the HII and others should be suspicious. The group discussion included Ace and therefore wasn't an alliance meeting. It was at its core, showing the disagreement between Corinne and Marcus. Our first hint that they will be adversaries. It was a good cool down for Marcus. It makes Marcus and Corinne even with two high-profile eps and one low. Charley: I agree. He continues to be the follower rather than leader, both in scenes and confessionals. Corinne: It's true that her praise and descriptions of Bob, though not derisive, have condescension in them. But, for the most part, she has been shown to be on top of her game. She's made successful moves and has been given confessionals and speeches to explain herself. These three players hold a unique place in the story so far: Golden-Boy Marcus on one side, hard-playing "bitch" Corinne on the other. Both are shown in scenes and confessionals to be playing the end game from almost their first scenes. In between them, we have smart observant narrator Charley. He's keen to play, but he's also shown as a follower and someone who has praised both Marcus and Corinne for their player skills. I think it's Marcus or Corinne's game to win at this point. I include Charley in that uniqueness for now, but his role so far has been the one who watches and narrates, and shines the spotlight on someone else. But, that could be a great way to hide in the middle of the action! |
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panurge46 |
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I read your own comments, flf, and found them as interesting as always. We do seem to be looking at the same story, how Kota is deep into end game already
while Fang is still stuck in the original sin of their birth!
I do want want to comment on this however: "It was at its core, showing the disagreement between Corinne and Marcus. Our first hint that they will be adversaries."
Last Edited By: panurge46
10/05/08 5:36 PM.
Edited 1 times.
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fat little fingers |
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Thanks for the Meeting on the Dock transcript, panurge. My notes were incomplete.
You're right, Corinne comes across much more in line with her comment, later, to Charley: "...We have to trust, beyond everything else, that our alliance is our alliance." I was wondering if this was meant to be read as a cynical ploy or not. But, when combined with her straight answer to Bob, "...I have Jacquie, Marcus, Charley, you know, we're all in your book. As long as you feel the same way we do, we're all in it together." and her answer at TC: "...But, the idea is you want one opinion together, so that you have as little dissension among the group as possible." These statements are all consistent and are shown without negative SPV or contradictory scenes attached. |
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Phoenix1269 |
Survivor Gabon Episode 3 Ratings | ||
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Overall Rankings
OTTN4 - Ace Gordon MOR2 - Bob Crowley MOR2 - Charlie Herschel CP4 - Corinne Kaplan MORP2 - Crystal Cox UTR1 - Dan Kay ?N2 - GC Brown INV1 - Jacquie Berg ?P5 - Sugar Kiper UTR1 - Kelly Czarnecki UTR1 - Ken Hoang MOR3 - Marcus Lehman UTR1 - Matty Whitmore ?N4 - Paloma Soto-Castillo MOR?3 - Randy Bailey INV1 - Susie Smith Episode Rating Averages From most to least (INV=1, UTR=2, CP=3, MOR=4, OTT=5) 4.33 - Ace Gordon 4.21 - Paloma Soto-Castillo 4.00 - Sugar Kiper 3.92 - Crystal Cox 3.83 - Bob Crowley 3.83 - Randy Bailey 3.71 - Charlie Herschel 3.67 - GC Brown 3.38 - Marcus Lehman 3.00 - Corinne Kaplan 2.08 - Dan Kay 2.00 - Kelly Czarnecki 2.00 - Matty Whitmore 1.88 - Ken Hoang 1.04 - Jacquie Berg 1.04 - Susie Smith Episode Tone Averages From most to least (NN=-2, N=-1, neutral=0, P=1, PP=2) 1.208 - Sugar Kiper 0.833 - Crystal Cox 0.333 - Ken Hoang 0.042 - Matty Whitmore 0.000 - Bob Crowley 0.000 - Charlie Herschel 0.000 - Dan Kay 0.000 - Jacquie Berg 0.000 - Susie Smith -0.167 - Corinne Kaplan -0.167 - Marcus Lehman -0.292 - Kelly Czarnecki -0.583 - Randy Bailey -0.750 - Paloma Soto-Castillo -1.000 - Ace Gordon -1.000 - GC Brown Episode Visibility Averages From most to least 4.96 - Sugar Kiper 4.04 - Ace Gordon 4.04 - Corinne Kaplan 4.04 - Paloma Soto-Castillo 3.00 - Randy Bailey 2.63 - Marcus Lehman 2.21 - Charlie Herschel 2.21 - Crystal Cox 2.17 - GC Brown 2.04 - Bob Crowley 1.21 - Dan Kay 1.08 - Matty Whitmore 1.04 - Kelly Czarnecki 1.04 - Ken Hoang 1.00 - Jacquie Berg 1.00 - Susie Smith Close Calls Rating GC Brown INV (0%), UTR (29.2%), CP (0%), MOR (45.8%), OTT (25%) Sugar Kiper INV (0%), UTR (0%), CP (50%), MOR (0%), OTT (50%) Paloma Soto-Castillo INV (0%), UTR (0%), CP (12.5%), MOR (54.2%), OTT (33.3%) Tone Randy Bailey NN (4.2%), N (50%), neutral (45.8%), P (0%), PP (0%)(note: 6 out of 11 neutral votes were for dynamic) Visibility There were no Close Calls for Visibility for Episode 3 |
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Phoenix1269 |
MOR Differential & RTV Season Averages - Episode 3 | ||
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Season Rating Averages From most to least
(INV=1, UTR=2, CP=3, MOR=4, OTT=5) 4.63 - Gillian Larson 4.21 - Michelle Chase 3.93 - Crystal Cox 3.76 - Charlie Herschel 3.64 - GC Brown 3.62 - Randy Bailey 3.39 - Marcus Lehman 3.33 - Bob Crowley 3.10 - Matty Whitmore 3.07 - Corinne Kaplan 2.99 - Ace Gordon 2.85 - Ken Hoang 2.52 - Dan Kay 2.46 - Sugar Kiper 2.42 - Paloma Soto-Castillo 1.86 - Susie Smith 1.51 - Jacquie Berg 1.35 - Kelly Czarnecki Season Tone Averages From most positive to least (NN=-2, N=-1, neutral=0, P=1, PP=2) 0.460 - Sugar Kiper 0.449 - Bob Crowley 0.362 - Ken Hoang 0.292 - Crystal Cox 0.127 - Charlie Herschel 0.086 - Marcus Lehman 0.057 - Matty Whitmore 0.043 - Dan Kay 0.043 - Jacquie Berg 0.000 - Susie Smith -0.069 - Corinne Kaplan -0.097 - Kelly Czarnecki -0.277 - Randy Bailey -0.333 - Paloma Soto-Castillo -0.379 - GC Brown -0.405 - Gillian Larson -0.514 - Ace Gordon -0.917 - Michelle Chase Season Visibility Averages From most to least 4.46 - Michelle Chase 4.35 - Gillian Larson 3.62 - GC Brown 3.57 - Randy Bailey 2.94 - Crystal Cox 2.93 - Marcus Lehman 2.92 - Ace Gordon 2.78 - Charlie Herschel 2.68 - Corinne Kaplan 2.64 - Dan Kay 2.61 - Sugar Kiper 2.38 - Ken Hoang 2.26 - Paloma Soto-Castillo 2.19 - Matty Whitmore 2.13 - Bob Crowley 1.32 - Jacquie Berg 1.32 - Susie Smith 1.01 - Kelly Czarnecki MOR differencial (Sum difference from middle of road for total season) 0.45 - Corinne Kaplan 0.54 - Marcus Lehman 0.61 - Ace Gordon 0.89 - Dan Kay 0.97 - Matty Whitmore 1.11 - Charlie Herschel 1.14 - Ken Hoang 1.28 - Crystal Cox 1.39 - Sugar Kiper 1.46 - Randy Bailey 1.64 - GC Brown 1.65 - Bob Crowley 1.65 - Paloma Soto-Castillo 2.83 - Susie Smith 3.22 - Jacquie Berg 3.39 - Gillian Larson 3.58 - Michelle Chase 3.74 - Kelly Czarnecki Note: Winner and Loser picks have been suppressed per request by FLF. |
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OnlyTheHunter |
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I'll listen to the discussion through tomorrow night for Tone close calls. Here's my opinion on Rating.
Close Calls Rating GC Brown INV (0%), UTR (29.2%), CP (0%), MOR (45.8%), OTT (25%) I voted OTT. I think he was. He wasn't on screen much, but the impact, from being a cancer to quitting for the tribe who finally won, etc., was very memorable. I'd have to pick MOR since OTT isn't an option. Low V does not have to equal UTR. He wasn't hidden, nor underdevloped. He was, however, solely one dimensional. Sugar Kiper INV (0%), UTR (0%), CP (50%), MOR (0%), OTT (50%) Flip a coin. I said CP because it is now impossible for fans not to feel they know her, but OTT isn't unfair. Paloma Soto-Castillo INV (0%), UTR (0%), CP (12.5%), MOR (54.2%), OTT (33.3%) OTT was my vote initially, and she was simply the one note best option to go. Michael |
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