S-17 Edgic (editing and logic) Gabon

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Cassidy666		#221	[-]
Posts: 8713 (09/26/08 2:17 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Jedijake wrote: Since Charlie is Todd redux, I don't see a repeat. The winner is clearly Marcus. If something strange does come down, I'd say that Corinne or Crystal are possible contenders. But only slightly. I don't see how their edits are the same. Similar maybe but Todd never went up to someone and dedicated himself to getting that person to the end. I'm hoping for more from those two women. They have the most potential to create drama in the game.
EOrlins		#222	[-]
Posts: 1084 (09/26/08 2:29 PM) Because it's just a stick!!! Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Oowatanite wrote: TLS ratings : Michelle- OTTN - She was relentlessly negative about just about everything. Randy- CPN - He was definitely CP, but to me he was complaining a lot in the first half of the episode. Eating a termite and flirting with Ken does not equal CP for Michelle. Her pathetic TC was overwhelmingly negative and OTT. I'm surprised that Randy is not getting that many N tone ratings. TLS put it perfectly - "he was complaining a lot". I don't think Randy was N! The complaining is only bad if everyone else tells us it is (like with Michelle). Randy only complains to the cameras and it is HYSTERICAL and curmudgeonly and not negative, at least in my view. Also, the sympathetic gash in the head and "I hope this doesn't get me voted off" is enough to counterbalance anyhow, right?
OnlyTheHunter		#223	[-]
Posts: 1633 (09/26/08 2:39 PM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I'm going to rewatch one more time to do ratings. Randy is tough. He's always right about his opinions as reinforced by the rest of the edit. If he's just bothering someone by his tone of voice, that's not editing intent. It has to be shown that he's causing a downer. In fact, he's avoiding causing drama. I do think it is easily a setup to make him crash and burn eventually. But here? I'll think some more. CL said "I'm not really doing the edgic thing anymore"! Be still my heart. Hey, I saw you post you were busy. I hope things are alright. I hope you don't abandon me entirely. Where do you think I spy on all my answers from? :-) Michael
Kitty Pryde1		#224	[-]
Posts: 5603 (09/26/08 2:39 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Episode 1: FANG TRIBE: Crystal-MOR3 Dan-MOR2 GC-CP4 Gillian-OTTM5 Ken-MORP4 Matty-MOR3 Michelle-CPN5 Randy-MORM4 Susie-UTR1 KOTA TRIBE: Ace-MORN4 Bob-MORP3 Charlie-MOR3 Corinne-MORM2 Jacquie-UTR1 Kelly-UTR1 Marcus-MOR3 Paloma-UTR2 Sugar-UTR2 I didn't give any INVs for the first episode just because of the whole "introduce yourself" thing before the pick 'em. Now, that's not to say that some players weren't eliminated anyway, but I think everyone was at least recognizable from that scene. I gave Ace a definite N because of the negative SPV and the arrogance in his confessionals that wasn't supposed to endear us to him. Randy got an M because of some of his comments towards Gillian, but also because they were reinforced, and he was somewhat sympathetic after his injury. I gave Corinne an M because of her bitch confessional being N and her "Bob is awesome" confessional being P. Everyone else I think is pretty straight-forward. Episode 2: FANG TRIBE: Crystal-MOR4 Dan-CP5 GC-OTTM5 Gillian-MOR4 Ken-UTR2 Matty-MOR3 Randy-CPP4 Susie-MOR2 KOTA TRIBE: Ace-INV1 Bob-UTR1 Charlie-CP3 Corinne-MOR2 Jacquie-UTR2 Kelly-INV1 Marcus-CP3 Paloma-INV1 Sugar-INV1 Many more INVs this time, but I didn't give one to Bob due to his SPV in regards to the onion alliance and the fact that he was the one shown fishing, he was the one shown making fire. Randy and Dan both gave us insight on themselves and their strategies. Danny got OTT because he was just so one-note in his immaturity in regards to the leadership position, and he was just so stupid. I gave him an M because he was negative with that immaturity, but he was also positive with being the heroic leader early with the fire and the fishing. I gave Randy a P because he was basically toneless except he was the other hero for coming up with the fishing hook idea, sacrificing his own glasses, plus he was the only person who stood up to the lunatics and said "Dan's just tired, he doesn't have the idol.". Those are the only things I feel really need explanation though. Winners: Marcus (Head and shoulders above EVERYONE else in this game. He's on the complex tribe. He's formed an alliance that doesn't seem to be all that opposed, and he's got Charlie as a distraction.) MASSIVE GAP Dan (Some people say he had a weak first episode, and he probably won't win. But we understand him and he's got a ton of distractions all around him. Hell, though, he could just be another Cirie. Someone who looks good, but that's all it is.) Randy (He's probably going to be a narrator, and he has an M for the first episode, but still, he's got good ratings.) Corinne (If we're getting another Danni, and it seems like we always have to prepare for that, Corinne's going to be our Danni.) Crystal (She's been very toned down for an Olympic athlete, which could be good for her. She's not being forced down our throat as a hero like you might expect.) Ken (He's got potential, but odds are he's the lovable loser underdog that we root for, only he doesn't win in the end.) Matty (The only reason my winner's list has so many Fangs is because they've gotten so much screentime, while a lot of Kotas have been eliminated already. Matty has two MOR3s, so I can't eliminate him quite yet.) Charlie (He seems like he's being too easily pigeon-holed into a gay stereotype, but he's not out of it yet.) Eliminated: GC (Dreamz 2.0. He's made to look like a knucklehead.) Susie (Not enough screentime, especially with two tribal councils.) Ace (INV1 in episode 2) Bob (Hero edit with a near INV in episode 2) Jacquie (Near INV in episode 1) Kelly (Two nearly invisible episodes) Paloma (INV in episode 2) Sugar (INV in episode 2) Last Edited By: Kitty Pryde1 09/26/08 2:52 PM. Edited 1 times.
OnlyTheHunter		#225	[-]
Posts: 1634 (09/26/08 2:44 PM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I like what Kitty did for Bob in ep 2. It was more than just a little SPV and camera time. Average viewers would easily recall his position after ep 2. That's a distinction between INV and UTR1, IMO. Bob is clearly present and featured, but only at a 1 V and only UTR applies. Kelly, oppositely, is truly INV. I know already I'm doing the same there. Michael
A Bartholomew		#226	[-]
Posts: 4395 (09/26/08 3:00 PM) Patriots:Worst 11-5 team EVER Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	The last 4 winners have been the exact same, the "mastermind". It's Onion man this time.
TheLurkerSpeaks		#227	[-]
Posts: 1291 (09/26/08 3:02 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Being entertaining or even being right doesn't mean a player isn't negative. Yes, it does matter how things are said because that's what we see, particularly in confessionals when we know that the Survivors are asked the same thing in different ways over and over again, and the editors choose which responses to air. Enough other people got irritated with Gillian to show their comments instead of going with Randy's, which didn't really differ much from what Michelle was saying. The difference between the two is that with Michelle, the negativity was her complete character (simplified OTT) whereas Randy was better developed with greater insight and more rounding (CP) with the head injury comments included. I agree in the second half, he came across much more strategic in his comments rather than complaining, which is why I had him neutral there. The fishhook was reporting in a set of scenes that demonstrated the whole tribe working together (for once), which I didn't feel gave him individual tone. He's not yet been presented as a player to root for, just one to watch.
Green Coffee		#228	[-]
Posts: 84 (09/26/08 3:04 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I find it really interesting that a large number of people OUTSIDE of Edgic are calling this season for Marcus already. To me, this suggests two possible interpretations: A: Marcus is too obvious of a winner to be a winner. If people who theoretically do not understand Edgic can figure the winner out at the outset, then that is indicative of Marcus being too obvious a candidate. This is where I can see the "Devil's Advocate" type discussion coming in. If the belief is that the winner should not be obvious to the average viewer, Marcus may be flawed in that non-Edgicians are already fairly sure that he is the frontrunner. B: The average viewer is getting good at a sort of "Lay-Edgic" If Marcus truly is the winner, the audience is getting to the point where they can implicitly understand the basic premise of Edgic. In a way, they have a sense of what makes a winning episode 1 edit and can make educated predictions accordingly. They don't call it Edgic and they don't understand the procedure, but they get the basics in a sort of "unconscious" way. I'm not sure which interpretation is correct. Either way I find it interesting. If interpretation B is what is really going on, it seems like that might be contributing to the ratings slide. I mean, even I feel like I could probably miss the premerge and lose out on very little of the story. If I did that and came back, you could almost bet your house that Marcus and Charlie are gonna still be there.
AllMenAreIslands		#229	[-]
Posts: 24280 (09/26/08 3:07 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	9RedWing19 wrote: I'm not Craig, but Michelle for me was CPN (by what constitutes a CP in Episode 1, when there are 17 other contestants fighting for airtime). She got strong reinforcement for her point of view at TC (complete with the famous Survivor chimes at the conclusion of one of her comments). She got the showmance scene with Ken (which could easily have been cut). It was a well crafted first boot edit (enough so that you could understand the decision, even though the editing would lead you to think that MB considered it a poor choice, given they booted Gillian after narrowly losing another physical challenge). I think that scene was more to shed light on Ken, not on Michelle. He is the one inside whose head it mattered for us to go.
BlakeB717		#230	[-]
Posts: 954 (09/26/08 3:18 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Even if we did the episode as 1 episode, Ace's edit is not that of a winner. He's being shown as arrogant but NO strategy at all. No alliance, nothing. We just see how he's going to play; as a leader who has no strategy to back it up. I agree that Randy wasn't N. I think he was M in the first episode, and P in the second. We're suppose to get that it's just his personality, and the editors are making him out for us to like his personality. He's funny, not negative. They could go a completely different route with him and have him being mean and having clown music when he got cut or having weird sounds when he whines and show him being lazy or something, but they haven't. I think Randy will go far on the Fang tribe, but I have a terrible feeling he is a pre-merger character. If he makes the merger, than he could very well be a HUGE contender. Biggest problem with everyone of Fang is that there are NO alliances being crafted. Kenny/Michelle was good, but it ended. Every season it seems there is some alliance shown in the first two episodes that has a winner. Parvati- The Showmance 4 Ep 1 Todd- Amanda Ep 2 Earl- nothing really but shots on mountain galore, and everyone seemed to come to him anyways Yul- Becky Ep 2 Aras- The Casaya 4 Ep 2 Danni- nothing really but she was a weird winners edit and she got that knowing Gary story in Ep2 Tom- Ian Katie Steph Ep 1 Chris- Older, Weaker Men Group Ep 1 Amber- Rob Ep 1/2 build Last Edited By: BlakeB717 09/26/08 3:25 PM. Edited 1 times.
astroline		#231	[-]
Posts: 1408 (09/26/08 3:25 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Good posts by everyone so far with ratings, now it's my turn to butcher it as usual! EPISODE 1 KOTA Ace: CP4 Bob: OTTP3 Charlie: MOR3 Corinne: MOR2 Jacquie: INV1 Kelly: INV1 Marcus: MOR3 Paloma: UTRN2 Sugar: UTR2 FANG Crystal: MOR3 Dan: UTR2 G.C.: CP4 Gillian: OTTM5 Ken: MORP4 Matty: MOR3 Michelle: CPN5 Randy: MORN4 Susie: UTR1 ------------------ EPISODE 2 KOTA Ace: INV1 Bob: INV1 Charlie: CPM3 Corinne: MOR2 Jacquie: UTRP2 Kelly: INV1 Marcus: CP3 Paloma: INV1 Sugar: INV1 FANG Crystal: MORP3 Dan: CPP5 G.C.: OTTM5 Gillian: MORM3 Ken: UTR2 Matty: UTRP3 Randy: MOR4 Susie: MOR2 I think it's interesting that Gillian doesn't seem to have a real P or N tone in either episode, but she did have a ton of tone, it was all over the place. She had tone in Episode 2 as well, but I've been seeing just plain MOR3's for her so far, I think she's mixed (as she was in the first episode too). Disappointing that Ace was INV in Episode 2, but I'd be biased towards him anyway probably since he's one of my favorites, so maybe it's for the best, especially considering my other favorites (Corinne & Crystal) are possible winners as it is. Speaking of which, I definitely think Crystal, Matty & Dan were supposed to be P in Episode 2. Winners list... 1. Marcus (but I really hope not, it'd be so obvious...) 2. Corinne 3. Crystal 4. Matty Charlie & Ken have decent edits so far, but their screentime revolved around other people - Marcus & Michelle, both of which were bigger, more important characters. Out of the 4 people I listed, Matty's the one without any real character development so far, but he's been there when it counts so far. Marcus is clear and away the front runner, but it just seems so obvious and so predictable (even to the viewer this time too, unlike Earl), because we've already been informed how amazing he is. What kind of winner would that be? Earl had the perfect winner edit too in the premiere, but he had next to no SPV from anyone else, ever, and Marcus already has tons confirming how good of a player he is. Hopefully they're just setting him up for a fall, and someone more interesting like Corinne or Crystal or Matty will step in and take the win instead with a less conventional edit.
colleenlover		#232	[-]
Posts: 8497 (09/26/08 3:32 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Every season since 1921, I have fallen prey to the devil's advocating of others (Courtney, Cirie) -so I'm going for the jugular. Marcus.
Sprinkles99		#233	[-]
Posts: 2 (09/26/08 3:34 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I knew Marcus was the winner when he started talking about "layers of the onion". If that isn't a good analogy for a winner's edit, I don't know what is.
iluvbbsofun		#234	[-]
Posts: 629 (09/26/08 3:37 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I knew Marcus was the winner when he started talking about "layers of the onion". That just means he has an alliance. Dumbass Marcus needs to start acting like George W. Bush or he won't be worth our time.
beatles20147		#235	[-]
Posts: 11768 (09/26/08 3:37 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Don't worry folks, I'm still around--just got Sucks'd out over the summer. I think GF's tiebreaker idea is perfect btw. Anyway, Marcus is definitely a potential winner pick, and if he is, I would expect a unanimous vote or close to it, because after these two episodes, he's just too perfect. Well, at least to Charlie. He's either the landslide winner or the victim of a major backlash later on. Randy's definitely negative. Take a look at the MSNBC poll, he's leading the votes for most annoying this season, and come on, the reason he actually has a fanbase in the first place is because of how much of a jerk he comes across as. And Michelle was OTTN for sure--just because they show you being right doesn't mean they're not making you look like a complete bitch. Speaking of which, Corinne is not delivering in that department at all. The one edit that's really puzzling me is Bob. Maybe I'm just looking at it as "Old guy, no way he lasts long" but even though he wasn't a significant part of the story, he's obviously destined for fan favorite status, much more than Ken, who isn't nearly as great as Probst promised (although it's early). If he'd been a non-entity in the second hour, I wouldn't really think much of it, as building up someone in the premiere and then tossing them aside wouldn't be a new phenomenon, but he was still there in part 2, and even got earmarked as a potential Onion ally despite it not amounting to anything. Then again, old guys don't necessarily have to go early; Bob's been compared to Yau-man and if his edit keeps up, I wouldn't be surprised to see him make the merge, and if he does that, he's definitely likely to get to the final five or so before getting the boot for being too likable to face in the end. Anyway, I'll just be happy with a seven-member jury and final two. And kudos to the editors for refusing to acknowledge Kelly. We've had a cute, 22-year-old blonde on an Africa-set season already and she was awesome. Lightning doesn't strike twice, SEG.
tropical rain	edgic ratings for episodes 01 & 02	#236	[-]
Posts: 149 (09/26/08 4:01 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Here we go... :) episode 01 ~ Fang Tribe Crystal - MOR3 Dan - UTR2 GC - MORM4 Gillian - OTTM5 Ken - MORP4 Matty - MOR3 Michelle - OTTN5 Randy - MORN4 Susie - UTR1 Kota Tribe Ace - CPN4 Bob - MORP3 Charlie - CP3 Corinne - MOR2 Jacquie - INV1 Kelly - INV1 Marcus - CP3 Paloma - UTR2 Sugar - UTR2 I hate to see Kelly and Jacquie start off with such a bad start...but with only two sentences, I had to give them INV1s. I felt as though Michelle and Gillian deserved OTTs for different reasons. Michelle for her relationship with Ken, being the last picked, but the first woman to get to the top of the cliff, and the situation of voting before tribal council. I thought we were almost supposed to root some for Gillian because Michelle seemed to be giving up (from what other people said), but also find her annoying (like at the immunity challenge). Then everyone else falls in the middle of those four people. episode 02 ~ Fang Tribe Crystal - MOR4 Dan - CPP5 GC - OTTN5 Gillian - OTTM4 Ken - MOR2 Matty - MOR3 Randy - MOR4 Susie - UTR2 Kota Tribe Ace - INV1 Bob - INV1 Charlie - CP3 Corinne - MOR2 Jacquie - UTR2 Kelly - INV1 Marcus - CP3 Paloma - INV1 Sugar - INV1 I thought that the Kota Tribe's edit was very interesting... Over half the tribe with INV1s, wow. I thought that GC and Gillian were over the top, either for leadership or for...Gillian just being Gillian. I forgot who caught the fish, and whoever did deserves to have a "P" by their name, lol. I don't have too much else to say... hopefully I did okay and next week will be easier with only one episode. XD Winner Choices: 1. Marcus. 2. Charlie. 3. Crystal. 4. Dan. Any suggestions with edgic? I'm still fairly new to this! :)
RageBot		#237	[-]
Posts: 195 (09/26/08 4:08 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	These are my observations after first viewing. Marcus is up for the running, and is probably in the best winner position as well as edit, yer, he seems almost too obvious, and I mean really obvious, he is just too much of an "in your face" winner, to really win, it seems like he is being set up for a fall, not for a win, he's gonna be the Rob C. of the season. I actually think Randy is in a good position, he get a lot of development (more developed than any other character in the game, and he shouldn't be that developed), he is spot on with his observations and he gives a lot of insight about the game aboth the social game, he seems to always know what's going on. Also, before the episode starts, there is a vid of a gorilla running alone in an open field, and during the opening clip, you can see that the gorilla is Randy. Ken gets a good underdog edit, Michelle could've get a less developed edit, like Mary from last season, was she getting that edit to portray her, or to show us more of Ken? Ken also got quite a lot of insight. Crystal is there for the game, she has a great Ep1 winner quote, and she seems competitive. Charlie has great insight on the two episodes, yet, he is to much about Marcus. They are my group of winner conteders. After second viewing i'm gonna put my ratings, and after third viewing i'm gonna vote on the site.
iluvbbsofun		#238	[-]
Posts: 632 (09/26/08 4:23 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Ace is my winner's pick right now even though I know he won't win. It is obvious Marcus or Corrine will win even though logically Ace should win because he had the best edit (if you say the season premiere was 1 long episode instead of 2). Hopefully Ace continues to run his mouth and win!
RageBot		#239	[-]
Posts: 196 (09/26/08 4:40 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Okay, ratings after second viewing, first episode: Crystal - MORP3 - She wasn't well-rounded enough to enforce a CP, yet she was positive with her competitivness, she got some screentime, and she has a confessional in the start. Dan - URP2 - He didn't have a lot of presence in the episode, but whenever he was shown, he was positive, especially in the TC in which he was talking about how Fang is strong and stuff. GC - CP3 - Didn't have that much of a presence, yet we've learned about his background, he is also willing to win and is there for the money, confessional in the begining. Gillian - OTTM4 - She was shown both as worthless and as a contributer around camp, she got quite a lot of screentime, yet the episode wasn't about her at any point. Ken - CP3 - We got his observation. he talked that he is good about strategy, he didn't get a lot of screentime, the Ken-Michelle relationship was used to show Ken. Matty - MOR3 - Was shown during the discussions, and got a confessional, but we don't know a lot about him, nor we have any insight from him, apart from his opinions about Gillian. Michelle - OTTN4 - Got a lot of airtime, was negative through most of the episode, didn't help at camp, complained a lot. Susie - UTR2 - The mom thing in the beginning, was shown talking a bit during the episode, nothing more. Kota Ace - CP3 - We learned that he is there for the money, and that he is both a physical and mental threat, yet he didn't get a lot of airtime beside of that yoga scene. Bob - MORP3 - Got some positive SPV, was working around camp and talking about it, also, how he wears his buff <3 Charlie - CPP3 - Got meaningful insight about the way Fang picked up pepole during the schoolyard pick, talked about strategy and his feelings towards Marcus, I feel like the regular viewer should root for him. Corrine - UTRP2 - Didn't get a lot of screentime, but when she was shown she was positive (the Bob SPV and she seems quite pleasent). Jacquie - INV - She didn't say a word during the episode. Kelly - INV - Same Marcus - MOR3 - Was quite neutral, didn't have a lot of insight yet was a presence in the episode, has the confessional in the beginning of the episode. Paloma - UTRP1 - Oh she was jiggling and was cute. Sugar - UTR2 - Said some funny things. Last Edited By: RageBot 09/26/08 5:01 PM. Edited 1 times.
trinity17888		#240	[-]
Posts: 520 (09/26/08 5:04 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	EOrlins wrote: Second of all, I think I should disclose biases up front. Charlie is a friend of mine from law school and I recommended him to casting. I had NO idea he had actually been selected until about halfway through filming, and he clearly won't tell me a THING about how he did, but I wanted to disclose my Charlie bias up front! (I LOVE HIM!) Eliza, why is Dan 'an "attorney" and Charlie a "lawyer" -- is there some distinction I don't know about? Considering it was a schoolyard pick... the two tribes are amazingly lopsided. We may just have another Stephanie season.

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