S-17 Edgic (editing and logic) Gabon

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NickF227		#2281	[-]
Posts: 5070 (11/07/08 3:59 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Yeah, and I'm really bothered by this. The winner is either Kenny, Randy, or Matty. End of story. Corinne's story is evil, Sugar's story is being naive and playing emotionally, Crystal is the distraction (she isn't a Todd, she's female and this season's theme isn't strategy like China's was), and Charlie's disappearance is 3x worse than any winner. How the hell is Randy's story not 'evil'(when it is) and how isn't he a distraction(highest visibility, no cooldown episode at all.). Um, yeah. Crystal has a bigger chance than him, IMO. He's never not had tone(except once where it was like debated, IIRC), while Crystal has had 3 toneless episodes(which where her first 3.)
cindidindi76		#2282	[-]
Posts: 13221 (11/07/08 4:17 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Madhackrviper wrote: MyChemicalShowmance wrote: I'm sorry... I know this is mean, but... Edgic being pwnt <3 Wow, you guyz shur r clevr!!!! just wondering if anyone can recall.... who were the people in the Episode 1 race up the hill who were called: selfish (or similar) helpful or a team player (or similar) dead-weight (or similar) I remember Marcus being called selfish as he went for the idol, GC too... which stood out for me at the time, but i was never able to figure out what it meant. Now that Marcus & GC are both gone... i feel like that race was important... or at least what was said about the race is important. Just wondering if there might be more clues there... hopefully i'll have time to rewatch episode 1 this weekend... thanks Selfish - Marcus and GC, amybe Michelle too. I don't think anyone who's left was "selfish". Helpful team player - Matty, big time. I think it was mentioned multiple times. And I'm thinking Bob and Dan too, but I'm not positive. Dead weight - Gillian, Crystal (her shoes were heavy!!!). Those were the biggies, I think. There were probably some more, someone probably still has it recorded and can check for sure. Regarding going back and "reconsidering" some close calls, isn't that kind of...cheating? Obviously the ratings people ended up with weren't agreed on by everybody or they wouldn't have been close calls to begin with, but to go back now and give people the oppourtunity to change their vote to make someone a more viable winner is kind of weak. Isn't that sort of the reason spoiled people aren't to make winner picks? The posts saying "OMG I was the only one who said Marcus wasn't winning!!!" are making me .
Green Coffee		#2283	[-]
Posts: 95 (11/07/08 5:31 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	DarkHelmet wrote: Before this season, I'd never seen Survivor. But, this year, a friend of mine is on the show, so I've been watching closely. I discovered this message board while trying to find clues about how my friend did. Most of the stuff on the Sucks board is standard internet crap, ("You suck." "No, YOU suck!) but the Edgic thread was civil, and appeared objective and analytical. That appealed to me. However, after a season of people overwhelmingly picking Marcus, he was sent packing, and along with it, any claim to legitimacy of edgic principles. Despite that, people are offering their new predictions, based on the very same edgic principles that just failed. For those of you who pride yourself on making logic-based judgements, you must understand that it's not valid to make conclusions based on false principles, right? Dissapointing as it may be for this board, while there is still plenty of room for speculation and discussion about this season, there's no longer any place for edgic-based analysis. At this point, it would just be revisionist history. I think what you guys were doing is fun, and interesting, but it's a little presumptuous to think that you could "outsmart" the staff at Survivor. The producers, and directors, and host and editors are all professionals, and expert storytellers. They know how to develop characters, build plotlines, and create conflict. Most of all, as storytellers, they know that a story with an obvious ending is not a very interesting story. While the Survivor team may have fallen into some patterns over the past seasons, these guys will always be a step ahead of you, and me and the other laymen. So, edgic is dead. But, on the brightside, this season got a lot more interesting. I think much of this is based on the assumption that this is the first season in which edgic has occurred. In fact, this has been done for years, with many failures and successful picks. Had this been a 1 time experiment, you'd be right. However, this is not the case. Also Edgically, Kenny and Matty are the only viable winner options left. Everyone else can be easily eliminated. Except by their fans, of course. and On these "resurrections". Players that had edits that have, in 16 seasons, eliminated them will and should REMAIN ELIMINATED! Resurrecting people like Sugar, Crystal, Corinne or Charlie are foolish to do so. are absolutely correct. Keep your heads on, Edgicers. Just because Marcus is out doesn't mean Edgic starts over. You can't just throw the rulebook out and start making exceptions for everyone you like.
BlakeB717		#2284	[-]
Posts: 1086 (11/07/08 5:37 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	How the hell is Randy's story not 'evil'(when it is) and how isn't he a distraction(highest visibility, no cooldown episode at all.). Um, yeah. Crystal has a bigger chance than him, IMO. He's never not had tone(except once where it was like debated, IIRC), while Crystal has had 3 toneless episodes(which where her first 3.) Crystal had 4 strong N's in a row. Done. Randy's edit has craft and he's had a few episodes in a row of strong 2s. He's the least likely of the top 3 males, but his edit is getting craft... but I agree he could be a distraction. But he's been hidden somewhat from the main action. Keep your heads on, Edgicers. Just because Marcus is out doesn't mean Edgic starts over. You can't just throw the rulebook out and start making exceptions for everyone you like. Yup! People bringing up Crystal, OK, I understand that, I back up Peih-Gee in China, but Corinne and SUGAR? Come on now!
beatles20147		#2285	[-]
Posts: 11907 (11/07/08 5:56 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	This season's just so mediocre. It's mildly entertaining, but I just don't really care about it all that much. ...is what I would've posted 24 hours ago (ok, I was in class then so make that 27 hours). That was absolutely beautiful. I think the anti-Edgic people are missing out on the crucial detail that everyone in Edgic is thrilled to be wrong. We want it to be unpredictable; we hate when we come up with the winner from the first 2-3 weeks (although admittedly there are a few fishy situations there--hello, massive Amanda support!). So feel free to post a series of s if you want, but seriously, we should be giving each other high fives on a job not well done and celebrating the fact that this is the most unpredictable season in years. Kudos to the editors for an amazing job. And kudos to CL for picking Marcus as the winner in the first place! Now that was the real good luck charm here. Now if you'd be so kind as to please pick everyone except Bob, Matty, and Sugar to win. Viva la Edgic! (However, if Charlie kills himself next week and Marcus returns to take his place, then I guess the party's over)
SwineForkbeard		#2286	[-]
Posts: 1847 (11/07/08 5:58 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	BlakeB717 wrote: LET'S GET A FEW THINGS STRAIGHT Edgic is going NOWHERE so don't bother coming in here saying it's failed or it's done because as long as SURVIVOR is around, edgic will exist. GOODBYE!!!! In other words, edgic is like alchemy, astrology, or talking to the dead. A specious pseudoscience that will always have a few stubborn proponents no matter how much it is discredited. The lack of spoilers to guide you this season has exposed the edgic Emperor's nakedness. If you can't tell me who's going to win when there are nine people left, then you're wasting your time. Anybody can make an educated guess about the outcome once half the cast is already gone and have a good chance of being lucky. But it shouldn't be confused as anything other than luck.
4 Horsemen		#2287	[-]
Posts: 140 (11/07/08 6:00 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	EDGIC FAILURE
colleenlover		#2288	[-]
Posts: 8681 (11/07/08 6:02 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I'm actually happy with any of the foursome winning and hopefully making it intact to the final four. I think we're going to see a lot of doubt and mistrust- like the Sugar/Matty scene regarding being duped by Ken and Crystal. But it's all going to come back to the half time scene post Ace boot at the Fang Camp. The clean slate was very, very specific, Matty's "you are Survivors," very important. And also note there was a sound byte where they all pledge NOT to reveal Sugar's idol. (there were no close up shots of anyone foreshadowing an arc with this, no cymbols clashing) I'm expecting doubt later on, but these four sticking together. *beatles, really? I'm finding this to be the best season since Marquesas.
SwineForkbeard		#2289	[-]
Posts: 1848 (11/07/08 6:09 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	beatles20147 wrote: So feel free to post a series of s if you want, but seriously, we should be giving each other high fives on a job not well done and celebrating the fact that this is the most unpredictable season in years. Kudos to the editors for an amazing job. Thank you, I will. Nice damage control there. You can try to rationalize it so you win either way, but let me spell it out for you. If the season is unpredictable, you admit there's a good chance edgic will be wrong. If the season is predictable, I don't need edgic to tell me what's going to happen. Either way, it's a waste of time.
BlakeB717		#2290	[-]
Posts: 1087 (11/07/08 6:13 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Swine, we aren't stopping edgic, call it ridiculous but we aren't. Go away. You're wasting your time.
YemaGrl1988		#2291	[-]
Posts: 2665 (11/07/08 6:37 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	BlakeB717 wrote: Swine, we aren't stopping edgic, call it ridiculous but we aren't. Go away. You're wasting your time. But he does give a good point and I think doing Edgic is wasting your time IMO, but what do I know? Hum de dum dum...
beatles20147		#2292	[-]
Posts: 11908 (11/07/08 6:41 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	SwineForkbeard wrote: beatles20147 wrote: So feel free to post a series of s if you want, but seriously, we should be giving each other high fives on a job not well done and celebrating the fact that this is the most unpredictable season in years. Kudos to the editors for an amazing job. Thank you, I will. Nice damage control there. You can try to rationalize it so you win either way, but let me spell it out for you. If the season is unpredictable, you admit there's a good chance edgic will be wrong. If the season is predictable, I don't need edgic to tell me what's going to happen. Either way, it's a waste of time. I'm not even saying it as damage control. Edgic was 150 to 200% wrong. Gabon was a complete disaster for us, no matter if we manage to predict the winner this week (and it's a total crapshoot to be honest). It's not a "win" for us; but the season just got a whole lot better. Edgic is more or less just a fun complement to the show, whether it's accurate or not. It's no less pointless than posting on a Survivor message board in the first place. *beatles, really? I'm finding this to be the best season since Marquesas. Wow--I loved the GC boot (which absolutely felt like an early season ep) and last night of course, but I wasn't entirely sold on most of the others. But I have a feeling that rewatching the earlier episodes without the cloud of "Marcus is definitely winning" hanging over me, it'll hold my interest a lot more.
SwineForkbeard		#2293	[-]
Posts: 1850 (11/07/08 6:42 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	BlakeB717 wrote: Swine, we aren't stopping edgic, call it ridiculous but we aren't. Go away. You're wasting your time. Beatles just explained how much you guys love being wrong, so this should only encourage you. If being wrong is what makes edgic worthwhile, then its future should be secure, and I'm sure this won't be the last time you get to experience that joy.
BlakeB717		#2294	[-]
Posts: 1088 (11/07/08 6:48 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	but what do I know? Well you do think Crystal wins... =X
SwineForkbeard		#2295	[-]
Posts: 1851 (11/07/08 7:00 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	beatles20147 wrote: Edgic is more or less just a fun complement to the show, whether it's accurate or not. It's no less pointless than posting on a Survivor message board in the first place. Oh, I beg to differ. This thread is exactly like the spoilers thread this season, ie a wasteland of speculation and wishful thinking, with one important difference. The spoilers admit they have nothing, and don't claim to have any special insight into what's going to happen.
colleenlover		#2296	[-]
Posts: 8682 (11/07/08 7:01 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	but I would still want a place where I could talk about the show and the editing in terms of storytelling. Of course, Edgic is not a perfect science- because (broken record) it's an art form to some degree. Different editing styles and so forth- and let's look at the reality of the game -it's been topsy turvy -so not much smoke and mirrors were needed and a lot of fun could be had -that mountain shot of Colby er, Marcus on the reward was pretty clever. And any naysayers saying the system doesn't work -well, what system are we talking about? Edgic is mostly a debate anyway and a constant struggle if numbers and percentages are valid over gut instincts. I personally don't do the numbers because I just don't understand it -I've shyed away from ratings because it's not really working for me. But I like picking out the themes and foreshadowing -why I can write off someone like Susie but keep someone like Matty still in it. If Edgic closed up shop, another editing thread would be created anyway. Every person who contributes is doing it in their own way, and bringing in new ideas, new detective work in looking at the mystery. I read a thread that bashed edgic, yet said they knew Parvati was winning a mile away -but how? Not from a gaming standpoint, but from the edit! (that is looking at the story, and not just like a sporting event that's happening in real time) So they are using a variation of this as well.
YemaGrl1988		#2297	[-]
Posts: 2678 (11/07/08 7:13 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	BlakeB717 wrote: but what do I know? Well you do think Crystal wins... =X You bet I do!
SwineForkbeard		#2298	[-]
Posts: 1852 (11/07/08 7:24 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I don't care if people want to portray this thread as a kind of intellectually rarefied salon where people discuss editing and storytelling and other esoteric snobbery. Just be prepared for ridicule if you start touting some prognosticative power beyond that of the average joe viewer. As long as edgicers claim to have a crystal ball and post stuff like what Oowankanite just posted as Sucks: Oh, and while Edgic may have been wrong in backing a Marcus win, they will still zero in on the actual winner A LOT faster than the spoilers will this season. ...then your track record and accuracy become fair game, and you should expect naysayers to call you out when your predictions turn out to be false.
colleenlover		#2299	[-]
Posts: 8683 (11/07/08 7:32 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	in my opinion, this thread is for me is just a haven where I can discuss the mystery. it's like a book club. No one here really believes there is a magical key that will always solve the solution to each different mystery. We're just using our knowledge from past events. Look, I'm a child of the 80s and I grew up on slasher flicks -which became a gorier version of And Then There Were None. You watch enough, most of the suspense goes away because you anticipate certain trends for the usual last person standing. A) men are usually toast. B) ahhh, that girl said something slutty, she's ain't going to be the last one left... C) plucky virgin who warns the others to not go into the old mansion (ding! ding!) - it's the same type of things I do when watching Survivior -just a different criteria. Did I love spoilers and vid cap analysis back in the day? Hell yeah -because it was still problem solving and figuring out what how it all worked together. But when the spoilers became a source with a full boot list it isn't fun and is just finding the answer key to the back of a text book. There is no magical solution here -that's correct to the naysayers. Only past trends and pyschology (sometimes in those slasher movies, a savvy director would use that knowledge of our comfortability to surprise by flipping it). But what I do know is in reality TV, there are story editors. (my friend worked as one on another show) I've learned predominantly that most shows map ideas while the game is happening, but really fine tune it once they know the ending. This is just a reality, and therefore I look for story themes and threads. And I talk about it here.
colleenlover		#2300	[-]
Posts: 8684 (11/07/08 7:38 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Just be prepared for ridicule if you start touting some prognosticative power beyond that of the average joe viewer Aha! This I agree with. I was going to say why the readiness to pounce -who cares? But if people are going around acting superior to others based on edgic and pretending to be better than others, I completely understand the need to say, "eat shit, told you so..." Me, I'm keeping it to my opinion on storytelling, and just think it's obvious and redundant to include in every post, IMO, in my opinion or some other interwebnet lingo jargin. And anyone going around and being superior based on edgic, is just setting themselves up to be a case study for a psychology class -IMO

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S-17 Edgic (editing and logic) Gabon

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