S-16 Edgic (editing and logic)

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GrenadeJumper85		#4541	[-]
Posts: 4632 (05/07/08 8:29 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	4) The winner is very unlikely to receive an INV rating during the course of the season, and will likely receive at least a 2 visibility in Episode 1. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) I think this one is so iffy. Parvati was damn near invisible during the swap episode.
AllMenAreIslands		#4542	[-]
Posts: 23674 (05/07/08 8:41 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	SFC wrote: I took some time to look through the Winner observations and how they rank with the Final 5. Green means they followed it. Yellow is Debatable. and Red is Failed. 1) The winner may have ups and downs, but is typically not too UTR/INV or too OTT. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 2) The winner will typically have a fair amount of meaningful editing and typically won't be ignored in long stretches. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 3) Typically the winner is not overly Positive or Negative. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 4) The winner is very unlikely to receive an INV rating during the course of the season, and will likely receive at least a 2 visibility in Episode 1. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 5) Over the course of the game the winner's presence and visibility should end up closer to the average of all the players. (The winner typically gravitates to near the top in MOR differential, which calculates the closeness to average in presence, tone and ratings). (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 6) Typically the winner is surrounded by players who keep our focus to distract us from the winner. These players are often OTT and much of the complexity and strategy centers in this core group. This core group can be a combination of members of more than one complex group, rather than all being from one, original tribe. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 7) The winner will have substantial comments/insight from many of the jury members that may resurface in front of the jury or mislead the audience on voting. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) Now that I'm poring over it, I wonder how Natalie gets a Green for #3. I think it's implicitly N to be so UTR/INV for so long; then when she did have significant facetime, she was NN. She should get a Red for this one. A similar argument for #6 - how is Natalie Green for this one?
SFC		#4543	[-]
Posts: 306 (05/07/08 8:45 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	AllMenAreIslands wrote: SFC wrote: I took some time to look through the Winner observations and how they rank with the Final 5. Green means they followed it. Yellow is Debatable. and Red is Failed. 1) The winner may have ups and downs, but is typically not too UTR/INV or too OTT. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 2) The winner will typically have a fair amount of meaningful editing and typically won't be ignored in long stretches. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 3) Typically the winner is not overly Positive or Negative. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 4) The winner is very unlikely to receive an INV rating during the course of the season, and will likely receive at least a 2 visibility in Episode 1. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 5) Over the course of the game the winner's presence and visibility should end up closer to the average of all the players. (The winner typically gravitates to near the top in MOR differential, which calculates the closeness to average in presence, tone and ratings). (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 6) Typically the winner is surrounded by players who keep our focus to distract us from the winner. These players are often OTT and much of the complexity and strategy centers in this core group. This core group can be a combination of members of more than one complex group, rather than all being from one, original tribe. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 7) The winner will have substantial comments/insight from many of the jury members that may resurface in front of the jury or mislead the audience on voting. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) Now that I'm poring over it, I wonder how Natalie gets a Green for #3. I think it's implicitly N to be so UTR/INV for so long; then when she did have significant facetime, she was NN. She should get a Red for this one. A similar argument for #6 - how is Natalie Green for this one? 3: Well for all but 1 of the Episodes she was a non entitity, I don't think 1 N or NN pushes her over the edge of N, I think of her as UTRN and for 6: Everyone had more focus than her, as above she was only in focus in Episode 11.
Katy Carney		#4544	[-]
Posts: 1082 (05/07/08 8:45 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Is Parvati the only one left to have gotten the visibility in Ep 1? Wow.
scepticA		#4545	[-]
Posts: 1356 (05/07/08 9:26 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Cirie got a solid 2 visibility in ep1. The range for "2" was 7-15, Cirie had a 12 with 2 confessionals. Not a superduper 1st episode, but totally within the edgic guidelines. ETA: Hey, guys, if you want to see how truly strong Parv and Cirie are re their edgic, just check the season MOR etc. numbers. They are both in PERFECT shape to win. Last Edited By: scepticA 05/07/08 9:57 PM. Edited 1 times.
chapera rocks		#4546	[-]
Posts: 8871 (05/07/08 10:39 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Just to point out. Tina had an INV1 ep 1. Vecepia didn't have a big ep 1. Brian didn't have a big ep 1. Amber didn't have a big ep 1. Danni didn't have a big ep 1. Aras didn't have a big ep 1, though he was featured in the Viveros scene.
colleenlover		#4547	[-]
Posts: 8108 (05/07/08 10:44 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	they don't have to have big episodes, but there is usally a tweak here and there- a cl flag if you will. And almost always they are featured before the first commercial break. (Tom and Amber, I believe, are exceptions) -Tina was a deliberate trick by being the only person (aside from her family/occupation intro) not to have a solo single frame shot to go along with the sole zero confessional.
beatles20147		#4548	[-]
Posts: 11536 (05/07/08 11:29 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Was it her alone, or the whole cast? I was thinking it was all of them (though I remember her quote about it). She had the Time cover all to herself--although I don't really think there was any real basis behind her being the chosen castaway other than her happening to be a hot chick* in a tiny bikini. *At the time. Oh snap! Vee may not have had a big ep 1 but the "Sarah's got a cute body--she paid a lot for it" line was one of the most memorable parts...I remember a lot of the early reviews of the premiere specifically mentioned that line as a highlight. So she definitely made her mark during the premiere even if she wasn't a big character.
chaperone		#4549	[-]
Posts: 2484 (05/08/08 1:14 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	beatles20147 wrote: Was it her alone, or the whole cast? I was thinking it was all of them (though I remember her quote about it). She had the Time cover all to herself--although I don't really think there was any real basis behind her being the chosen castaway other than her happening to be a hot chick* in a tiny bikini. *At the time. Oh snap! The cover read "America likes to watch" or something like that, and it had Jenna Lewis with binocular outlines around her in her bikini. It was all about how voyeuristic this new craze called reality TV is.
getting real		#4550	[-]
Posts: 1189 (05/08/08 7:25 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	OTH, are you subscribing to my long-held penultimate episode thesis? Speaking of guidelines, I agree with Panurge that they don't carry the full force of the law. I mean no-one has been carted away to any penitentiary for breaking guidelines. They're there to be stretched, even to breaking point when *logic*, in this case editing logic, demands that they be so stretched. And Venatrix Avia, are you going to sanction Jillian Lindsay Lohan?
Warrior		#4551	[-]
Posts: 2595 (05/08/08 7:55 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	SFC wrote: I took some time to look through the Winner observations and how they rank with the Final 5. Green means they followed it. Yellow is Debatable. and Red is Failed. 1) The winner may have ups and downs, but is typically not too UTR/INV or too OTT. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 2) The winner will typically have a fair amount of meaningful editing and typically won't be ignored in long stretches. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 3) Typically the winner is not overly Positive or Negative. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 4) The winner is very unlikely to receive an INV rating during the course of the season, and will likely receive at least a 2 visibility in Episode 1. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 5) Over the course of the game the winner's presence and visibility should end up closer to the average of all the players. (The winner typically gravitates to near the top in MOR differential, which calculates the closeness to average in presence, tone and ratings). (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 6) Typically the winner is surrounded by players who keep our focus to distract us from the winner. These players are often OTT and much of the complexity and strategy centers in this core group. This core group can be a combination of members of more than one complex group, rather than all being from one, original tribe. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) 7) The winner will have substantial comments/insight from many of the jury members that may resurface in front of the jury or mislead the audience on voting. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) Parvati: 6 right 1 Maybe Cirie: 5 right 1 Maybe 1 Wrong Amanda: 2 right 2 Maybe 3 Wrong Erik: 3 right 2 Maybe 2 Wrong Natalie: 1 Right 6 Wrong Very nice post SFC. 4) The winner is very unlikely to receive an INV rating during the course of the season, and will likely receive at least a 2 visibility in Episode 1. (Amanda, Cirie, Erik, Natalie, Parvati) I think Parvati edit was pretty much close to perfect as far as visibility is concerned. Her low visibility in episodes 4 - 7 is something I look for when looking for the winner. Cirie on the other hand a 5 in episode 2 and 3 (in episode 2 she was 3 times the episode average) and it is not typical of a winner to get 5's that early, if at all, in the game. Amanda completely fails this guideline.
GrenadeJumper85		#4552	[-]
Posts: 4639 (05/08/08 8:04 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I'm still having a hard time with the 4-5 episodes Parvati was neglected pre-merge, because when compared to the last four winners we've had (Aras, Yul, Earl, Todd) NONE have ever dropped off the radar for 4-5 episodes straight pre-merge, like Parvati did. This is just going strictly by the charts, but the only person even remotely close to the past couple of winners, editing wise, is Cirie. Plus, I still think Parvati was invisible the switch episode. :p
OnlyTheHunter		#4553	[-]
Posts: 1507 (05/08/08 8:15 AM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	gr, I've always held to the penultimate thing. It hasn't failed once. Been more pronounced some season than others, but never failed. What do you think about the winner now? Last episode sucked for us. cl said I don't have the fondness for Cirie this season -still pulling for her, but it's not the joy I had when I watched her before. That's either you CL, or in my view, subtle Tone editing. Good work, editors, to keep a former fan's "fave" from coming off the same way while being the "same person." I think it was intentional. grenade, watch Chris in Vanuatu, for eps 3-5. Other than a debated CP that wasn't to most, he was completely UTR. It's not a bad thing. Michael
Francois40		#4554	[-]
Posts: 2175 (05/08/08 8:27 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	gr, I've always held to the penultimate thing. It hasn't failed once. What, specifically, defines "the penultimate thing (which has never failed)", since I presume you'd be talking about tonight's episode? kthx...
GrenadeJumper85		#4555	[-]
Posts: 4640 (05/08/08 8:35 AM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I always use the season recap during the finale episode to pinpoint who the winner is, especially last season. Amanda was so neglected during it that I was like there is no possible way she's winning.
getting real		#4556	[-]
Posts: 1190 (05/08/08 8:48 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Francois, basically, the 'guideline' is used to eliminate the person edited as likely to win in the second-last episode. Conversely, the person given the most doubt in that episode is usually the winner. Lol, OTH. Not too sure about Alexis' chances any more but I'm still clinging to the theory that, in this special edition of returning players, group edits are more important than individual edits and that the favorites as a group have not been edited to win throughout the season. Long-shot now, I know, but like you, I'm sticking with it until I get Alexi'd two more times .
fat little fingers		#4557	[-]
Posts: 5498 (05/08/08 9:11 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	GJ: I'm still having a hard time with the 4-5 episodes Parvati was neglected pre-merge, because when compared to the last four winners we've had (Aras, Yul, Earl, Todd) NONE have ever dropped off the radar for 4-5 episodes straight pre-merge, like Parvati did. This is exactly why Watchdogs were created. To begin with, it was two UTR1s and one UTR2: three UTRs in a row, not 4-5. That's pretty damned low, but by that point we were expecting a female winner. Female winners have always received lower visibility than the men. Why? Ask SEG. It's probably some sexism on the part of the eds and the awareness of sexism in the tribes. The successful women avoid the "aggressive leader" tag as much as possible, which means keeping a lower profile. The very broad winner pattern is usually early game establishment (game cred), a fade into the general background between eps3 and 7, with a rise in complexity and visibility between just before and just after the merge. Two words to emphasize from that claim are "broad" and "usually". That's where all the fun is in this game.
craig		#4558	[-]
Posts: 13024 (05/08/08 9:37 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I thought I'd lose interest in this season after Eliza left -but it's been pure fun. I don't have the fondness for Cirie this season -still pulling for her, but it's not the joy I had when I watched her before. I thought Eliza was fantastic this season though and brought it, and is still bringing it on the jury. Maybe because Eliza was the same good ole underdog she was in Vanuatu, but Cirie has been part of the power alliance since ep.3. There was some Cirie vs Ozzy editing, but no Cirie vs Parmanda stuff. Since the merge, Cirie has became merely a member of Team Parmanda and the Black Widows Brigade. That's not great for her chances.
colleenlover		#4559	[-]
Posts: 8109 (05/08/08 9:52 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	does Parvati pay you to do PR for her or something? Parmanda?
craig		#4560	[-]
Posts: 13025 (05/08/08 9:58 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Any different from you liking Colleen and Janelle and doing PR for the greatness of the early seasons? Maybe if there were live feeds reports or she appeared in season 1-4 you'd like her more. :)

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