The presence of the idol completely changes every strategic dynamic of the game, and to say that those players who utilized the idol effectively should be
recognized as having finished in 6th place is to ignorantly assume otherwise. Without the HII, everything would have happened much differently. It's
utterly idiotic and, to be honest, not worth specifically debating over, to believe you can remove the idol's influence from the game and consider Yau and
Amanda 6th place finishers.
0 Kudo
- Survivor Sucks
- Lions, Tigers, Survivors - Oh My!
- Survivor Spoilers
- MESS Hall Tribal Council
- MESS Hall Archive
- Survivor Speculation
- Survivor 20+
- The Amazing Race
- Big Brother
- Big Brother - PAST SEASONS
- The Apprentice
- American Idol
- American Idol PAST SEASONS
- The Mole
- Lost
- Other Shows That Suck
- Off Topic
- Clubs That Suck. No, Really.
- The Dump
- Monster Island
- Purgatory
- FAQ
- In Memory, 9/11/01
CR'S TAR TEAMS COUNTDOWN - Finally updated!
| Started By | Comment | ||
|---|---|---|---|
 Pulau Tiga |
|||
|
Posts: 5206 (06/21/09 11:32 PM) Registered user |
|
||
|
ncassaro |
|||
|
Posts: 1342 (06/21/09 11:33 PM) |
Dictatorship wrote: Totally disagree. In hindsight, maybe not so impressive. But at the time, Fang was edited to be complete idiots. The editors hated them so much that nobody expected Fang to dominate ever. Edgic concurred. There were no spoilers. Everyone thought it would be a boring, Kota-dominated merge. Even during the episode, Susie said that she would rather stick with Bob and Marcus. Marcus obviously lied to Susie but she seemed to buy it. The Marcus blindside was incredible and not overrated at all. And I even really liked the guy until his Ponderosa videos and interviews where he was a total douche. And yeah, I was hoping for a merge at 10 and even posted a thread to that effect... and we will always wonder what would have happened. But saying Susie going with Fang was obvious is so retrospective. We had been presented with crazy, dumb Susie. It was LOGICAL for her to vote with Ken/Crystal, but we had NO reason to expect that she would do it. |
||
|
Thailandsurvivor |
|||
|
Posts: 7421 (06/21/09 11:35 PM) |
Pulau Tiga wrote:Neither Yau nor Amanda were targeted because of their idols like James or Ozzy, so it's not close to completely idiotic. With that said, they could get rid of the idols once and for all, and I would end this debate. I'll be crossing my fingers for next season. |
||
|
Pulau Tiga |
|||
|
Posts: 5208 (06/21/09 11:37 PM) Registered user |
Thailandsurvivor wrote:Debatable, but irrelevant. Without the idol in the game, people would have played differently. With people playing differently, we would not have seen the same exact boot order, except with Yau and Amanda getting 6th place. |
||
|
Thailandsurvivor |
|||
|
Posts: 7422 (06/21/09 11:40 PM) |
Well, without the idol, Edgardo doesn't leave in 9th and who knows what he can pull off, so you are kind of right. I'm just going off what was on the
show. Cassandra wants Yau out to save Stacy, and Dreamz wants him out to not have to make a decision at the final 4.
Amanda is talked about as a huge jury threat and is seen to have the least amount of relationships with the fans. |
||
|
survivorisdabest |
|||
|
Posts: 3323 (06/22/09 12:18 AM) Registered User |
I love how T_S ignored CR's completely valid explanation of why his logic that Amanda should be 6th is wrong.
Alexis blindside <3 <3 <3 it would be in my top 4 Burtn blindside <3 <3 <3 definately deserves to be top 10 good list CR!!! |
||
|
Thailandsurvivor |
|||
|
Posts: 7424 (06/22/09 12:23 AM) |
survivorisdabest wrote:How did I ignore it? I said she would have gotten 5th had Cirie forced the tie. (Sorry, a 66% chance she'd get 5th.) CR said it was proven that Cirie would have forced a tie. I don't get how it can be proven when Cirie is saying that in retrospect after the game is over and wants to look good in the eyes of the public by being loyal to her alliance. I'm not saying she wouldn't have, but without the idol, Amanda doesn't get to the final 2. |
||
|
tullfan2 |
|||
|
Posts: 3510 (06/22/09 7:58 AM) Registered User |
Thailandsurvivor wrote: Thai, your arguments are very incomplete. Yul benefited from twists but he was also hurt by them as well. Aitu was forced to vote out Cao Boi even though they won the combined RC/IC challenged. The option to mutiny is also a twist and is not offered every season. Yul had no control over both Candice and Jonathan deciding to mutiny. They each had about 10 seconds to decide to mutiny so no discussions were possible. Without both of those twists, Aitu and Yul would have had a numbers advantage instead of being down by 4 people. |
||
|
PostnumberZERO |
|||
|
Posts: 284 (06/22/09 9:54 AM) REALLY slow learner |
My number one is the Christy one. Accidently ran into 2 spoilers twice, then Christy being in drivers seat, Jenna giving up immunity, thought Jenna, my hated
survivor of that season was going, then Christy gets voted out, sorest loser final words, then blindsights the audience by voting FOR jenna at the end. In
fact, the more I think about it, the biggest blindsight was Jenna winning 6-1. But then again, these two really tie in together.
|
||
|
Thailandsurvivor |
|||
|
Posts: 7426 (06/22/09 10:07 AM) |
Thai, your arguments are very incomplete. Yul benefited from twists but he was also hurt by them as well. Aitu was forced to vote out Cao Boi even though they won the combined RC/IC challenged. The option to mutiny is also a twist and is not offered every season. Yul had no control over both Candice and Jonathan deciding to mutiny. They each had about 10 seconds to decide to mutiny so no discussions were possible. Without both of those twists, Aitu and Yul would have had a numbers advantage instead of being down by 4 people.I'll give you the double boot, but the mutiny helped Yul. Had there not been one, Candice and Jonathan blindside Aitu at the merge which would have been a million times more disastrous for them. Yul would not have the chance to convince Jonathan to vote with them because he'd never be doubting them in the first place. |
||
|
survivorisdabest |
|||
|
Posts: 3330 (06/22/09 10:11 AM) Registered User |
ThaiSu, Cirie even said at the start of the F5 episode that she was right at the point where she was going to force a tie so saying that she was lying in interviews to please fans is ridiculous. |
||
|
Thailandsurvivor |
|||
|
Posts: 7428 (06/22/09 10:16 AM) |
All I'm saying is that if she was being honest, every single person who defends the HII for brining an entertaining aspect to the game needs to shut the
hell up since a tie would have been a million times better than what happened.
|
||
|
survivorisdabest |
|||
|
Posts: 3331 (06/22/09 10:17 AM) Registered User |
OK then you admit that Amanda wouldn't have been 6th had the HII not existed. Tie is forced and Amanda/Alexis/Erik are all safe until the final 5.
|
||
|
Thailandsurvivor |
|||
|
Posts: 7430 (06/22/09 10:19 AM) |
Amanda would not have made it as far as she did without the idol. Is that better? Same goes for Yau.
|
||
|
survivorisdabest |
|||
|
Posts: 3332 (06/22/09 10:27 AM) Registered User |
But saying Amanda should have been 6th in microensia is incorrect....
|
||
|
JackSparrowBauer |
|||
|
Posts: 1496 (06/22/09 10:52 AM) |
Yau actually would've gotten 6th place with no idol. With no idol in Micronesia, it's a completely different story. |
||
|
survivorisdabest |
|||
|
Posts: 3334 (06/22/09 11:18 AM) Registered User |
^I was just about to say that.
Lord Cassandra and Dreamz were after Yau anyway and his idol just added a complication. Yau had no way of staying in the game if he didnt have the idol because Stacy/Boo/Dreamz were firmly with Cassandra. The situation is different from micronesia where there were two groups of 3 |
||
|
solesurvivor01 |
|||
|
Posts: 6125 (06/22/09 11:25 AM) Registered user |
The dynamics of Fiji were much more complex at the F6, and I'll play devil's advocate for a bit. To be fair, Dreamz/Cassie went after Yau-Man at the
F6 because they knew it had to be done before the F5, which was the last chance for him to play his idol. So for all we know they might have waited one more
round to do it if he didn't have an idol. Then, if he still won immunity at the F5, Cassie/Dreamz would be fucked, and things may have happened the same
way. I'd say there's a very good chance Yau-Man goes at the F6 without an idol, but there's no way to know for sure.
|
||
|
chapera rocks |
|||
|
Posts: 11416 (06/22/09 4:37 PM) Registered User |
Thank you, SS01.
Whether or not the idol brings entertainment or not is a completely different argument than saying the Amanda or Yau-Man should be considered 6th place. And while on the subject of Sandra, can I just say she's a very underrated strategist? She was the only one who seemed to get the fact that Burton and Jon needed to be split up, and the others only came around at final 5. |
||
|
solesurvivor01 |
|||
|
Posts: 6131 (06/22/09 4:44 PM) Registered user |
chapera rocks wrote:Giant Red ecks. Sandra had some faults, that's for sure, but she's not given enough credit for what she did do. |
||
- Survivor Sucks
- Lions, Tigers, Survivors - Oh My!
- Survivor Spoilers
- MESS Hall Tribal Council
- MESS Hall Archive
- Survivor Speculation
- Survivor 20+
- The Amazing Race
- Big Brother
- Big Brother - PAST SEASONS
- The Apprentice
- American Idol
- American Idol PAST SEASONS
- The Mole
- Lost
- Other Shows That Suck
- Off Topic
- Clubs That Suck. No, Really.
- The Dump
- Monster Island
- Purgatory
- FAQ
- In Memory, 9/11/01
