Most Overrated/Underrated Player

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growsonwalls	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#81	[-]
Posts: 3482 (03/27/07 7:35 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Overrated - Sandra. Yes, overrated, because I think the Sandra fans loved her personality and forgot how worthless she was. In any other season, Sandra's a Katie. Sandra would probably have lost to Fairplay. Lill voted for Sandra because she thought she had a better shot against Sandra. She also liked Sandra and didn't want Fairplay winning, but the fact is Lill voted out Fairplay by saying the jury would see him as a genius and that she had a better shot against Sandra. Underrated - as much as I hate him, Chris. I despise everything about this sexist sadistic fatfuck but he played one hell of a game. He overcame seemingly insurmountable odds, understood women and their tendency to infight fiercely in close quarters, and pulled the most insincere fake tears apologies out of his ass to get jury votes. And it worked. Sitting next to Twila, who was apologizing with real tears, and really needed the money. Vanuatu is my least favorite season because I nearly barfed when he won, but if sociopaths in training Rich and Brian are revered here, Chris has to join them. And I mean this in a good/bad way. I hate Chris. Like Rich and Brian, I think he sucks at life, which is much longer than 39 days, but he was great at Survivor.
El Syd 01	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#82	[-]
Posts: 4 (03/27/07 7:36 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* Because those were both huge mistakes for her. She was the third wheel in Jerri/Mitchell/Amber, possibly even the fourth wheel if Colby stayed with them. She had no shot at winning by staying with Jerri after the merge, and then she didn't even bother trying to break Tina's spell over Rodger/Elisabeth, as she admitted to in her post-show interviews. Amber didn't do a damn thing in Australia. Amber had a f3 alliance with Colby and Jerri, had a good relationship with Tina and Keith liked her. Seems like a well enough position to me. Not breaking Tina's spell says way more about Tina, Rodger and Elisabeth's game than Amber's. *Quote:* Like when she pissed off her strongest potential ally, Alicia, on Day 2? Yeah, she was lucky to be on a tribe with people like Tom, Alicia, Mariano, and Sue, who were bound to clash all over the place. I took that as Alicia just being Alicia. She was put on a tribe of large personalities but that alone doesn't ensure your survival. Any tribe she was put on she's most likely the quietest one. That's just as much of a liability as being too loud. *Quote:* And she almost never wins. Hell, if she approaches the wrong person in the beginning of the game, she goes before the merge as a liability. She was very lucky to make the merge on Australia anyway. Do you think she would have gone over Jerri when Mike left? Because the vibe I got was Jerri was clearly on her way out. No way Tina or Colby or Keith keep her any longer than they have too. Even if Ogakor goes in 6-4, Amber is probably kept around and still ends up in a similar position. And with Jeff/Alicia there and factors such as immunity, who knows what could have happened. As for approaching the wrong person...in both cases people approached her. What was she supposed to do, tell them no? Have as many alliances as you need and if they work out great, if not, then you need to do something about it. Obviously didn't do enough in S2 but at least she did in S8. *Quote:* Not saying Amber didn't deserve to beat Rob in the F2, but I think its very hard IMHO to come to the opinion that doing absolutely nothing and hiding behind someone hated while having no strategic ability, no challenge ability, and only enough social ability to get you slightly above one of the most despited players ever is a strategy anywhere on the level of the other 12 winners. Yes, that will win you the game if you have the luck to get to final 2 like Amber did. But its very hard to respect that kind of game. I see what your saying but no way did she lack social or challenge ability. One of the reasons she was able to go as far as she did in both seasons is because she was well liked and had the physical capabilities in challenges. She was always up there in both seasons challenge wise.
JaMalle	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#83	[-]
Posts: 4814 (03/27/07 7:45 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* She's the only winner in the history of the game to have only one jury vote cast for her HAHAHAHA interesting way of putting it. I never thought of it that way! lol Shane's jury vote debate- If Shane would vote Danielle (who he absolutely positively despised) over Aras, then he'd definately vote Cirie over Aras. End of discussion. *Quote:* He played Caryn on his own. It's not like Caryn just decided, "I like Tom. Let's let him win." Tom had to tell her what she wanted to hear, and he did just that. He made promises to her that kept her loyal. Caryn was stupid. Tom sold her complete bullshit and Caryn was too stupid to catch on to it. to be honest, anyone could have nabbed Caryn. Tom was just the first. Also, Caryn's spite against Katie is also what motivated her. Once the bitch got hissy about Tom sealing her fate, she got upset because she knew she'd blown everything by not joining the female alliance. Thus her outburst at TC. Ok no more of me spewing random hate over Caryn. Bottom line is that she single handedly gave Tom the game at F7. Compound that with crucial IC wins and Ian wimping out over "emotional issues". *Quote:* At Final 5? Yeah, thanks to Ian's poor tactical plays, and those two guys managed to keep themselves around anyway. At they hypothetical Gregg-still-in-the-game Final 5? Tom prevented that from happening. no, at F7 when Katie constrcuted the Stephenie/Jen/Katie alliance that was supposed to include Caryn.... At F5, didn't Tom have immunity? No way should Katie have ever backstabbed Ian. that would completely demolish her jury chances against one of the girls. *Quote:* Rodger WANT to recruit Amber to oust Keithy/Colby, but Elizabeth is so fixture on being next Colleen feel that she need to keep her sweetheart issue. that was a moral decision made by Liz and aided by Tina. Again, Tina made sure Liz and Amber would never align. *Quote:* It is understandable why we think Brian is overrated because we don't fully understood why he won. Because he lied to the entire tribe besides Clay and Jan and took the goat that he had the best shot against. He kept everything hush hush and when people started to talk (Ted and Helen) he made sure they were eliminated. It helped that clay was a jackass to Jed and didn't answer Helen's question. that's why Brian won. *Quote:* Just the previous round the two of them voted for her...as far as she was concerned she was final four (thanks to her relationship with Colby). From there on out she would have to rely on immunity but she was second to Colby a few times (and even beat him at the F6 RC). Why in the world would they take Lis and Rodger over her? Why risk approaching R/L and getting kicked out when in her mind she was safe for at least another round. Also "just a few rounds ago" the entire tribe went against her wishes and voted Jerri out. Her trust for her alliance and others should have went out the window right then and there. It didn't, and that's why she was a horrible player.
fanofcoils	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#84	[-]
Posts: 3177 (03/27/07 8:11 PM) I need a life Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Twila really needed the money? What about Chris? He had basically the same job as Twila. Twila actually had more jobs I think than Chris. Twila worked like 3 jobs during the week. Was Twila married during Vanuatu?
fanofcoils	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#85	[-]
Posts: 3177 (03/27/07 8:12 PM) I need a life Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Who played a more aggressive game, Katie or Becky?
Quiddity	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#86	[-]
Posts: 6780 (03/27/07 8:21 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* I see what your saying but no way did she lack social or challenge ability. One of the reasons she was able to go as far as she did in both seasons is because she was well liked and had the physical capabilities in challenges. She was always up there in both seasons challenge wise. I wouldn't say Amber was a terrible social player, but she wasn't a great one either. She won because she played at best an average social game while Boston Rob played a horrible social game. When someone comes up with a list of great or good social players, I doubt we'd see Amber on there. Challenge wise, she won one individual challenge in two full seasons. That's StepheME esque. So I can't take the 'up there in both seasons challenge wise' line seriously, sorry :P You switch Boston Rob with Rich or Rupert on ASS and I could definately see Amber being a pre-merge boot as a challenge liability.
fanofcoils	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#87	[-]
Posts: 3177 (03/27/07 8:40 PM) I need a life Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Rob didn't do anything wrong socially with Lex or Tom. He just backstabbed them. Only made fun of them in confessionals, not to their faces. The only two people he did not play a good social game with (that we actually saw on TV) were Alicia and Shii Ann. I don't think that is enough for him to be called a terrible social player on ASS. Lex was just pissed at him because he betrayed him, not because he wasn't nice to him. Tom was also pissed at him because he betrayed him. Not because he wasn't friendly with him. Lex was an idiot but Rob could have gotten Tom's vote if Rob told Tom that he made a mistake, Tom wasn't going to betray him, and he regrets what he did.
diqsdl	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#88	[-]
Posts: 349 (03/27/07 8:56 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	My ratings for each winner: Richard = credit-rated (really really low) Tina = Cu-rated (she belongs in the museum with the mummies) Ethan = AAA-rated (this guy's got a spot clean image) Vee = Vene-rated (Thank you Lord!) Brian = XXX-rated (nuff said) Jenna = R-rated (this show may contain nudity & coarse language) Sandra = Pi-rated (by Rupert) Amber = Satu-rated (with Morono jizz) Chris = Be-rated (by Twila) Tom = fire resistance-rated Danni = NR (not rated, too insignificant to rate) Aras = lowest rated Yul = Gy-rated (with fat natives)
chapera rocks	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#89	[-]
Posts: 12205 (03/27/07 9:40 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* She's the only winner in the history of the game to have only one jury vote cast for her Brian recieved 3 anti-Clay votes: Jan, Helen, and Ted. The only vote for him was Jake. Nice try.
JaMalle	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#90	[-]
Posts: 4814 (03/27/07 9:49 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	nope, Jan was gonna vote for him no matter what.
RobVanStratus	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#91	[-]
Posts: 9567 (03/27/07 10:06 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Jan was Brian's loyal pet the whole time. She was going to vote for him to win for carrying her to the end. He's the one who told her if she voted off Helen she'd get 3rd place and she was happy with it. And if we want to get into the anti-vote argument, there's a shitload against all the winners. Sue voted against Kelly, Sean/Greg voted against Kelly because they refused to lose to a raft guide. Jerri voted against Colby, not for Tina. Africa I'm unsure of. John/Tammy/Robert voted against Neleh for her betrayal. Almost the whole jury voted against Lil for being an Outcast and refused to let her win. Lex/Kathy/Alicia/Tom voted against the both Rob and Amber in allstars. I can continue on but as you can see, the votes against the people are for various reasons. S1 it was because people like Greg/Sean who felt they were better than others for their education and didn't want to reward someone who didn't go to college, while in S7 it was because of someone being given a 2nd chance in the game that they were voted against, onto people's social games causing them to lose votes. All the juries have someone who is voting so that someone loses the million and that is part of the game. But all that matters is getting the 4 votes and if the other 3 votes feel like they were ostracized, it doesn't matter, cause the person has already won.
JaMalle	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#92	[-]
Posts: 4814 (03/27/07 10:23 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	FOR Votes: Tina- Alicia, Keith, and Liz Vecepia- Sean Guess we were wrong. V only got one vote. lol Brian- Jan and Ted Jenna- Heidi and Christy Sandra- Rupert and Christa Amber- ShiiAnn Chris- Chad and Julie Tom- Stephenie and Ian Danni- Bobby Jon, Gary, and Lydia? Aras- Cirie, Austin, and Sally Yul- Sundra, Adam, John, and Brad I guess it's pretty hard to actually rack up the jury (except for Yul, Aras, and Tina), but I guess the even bigger goal is to bring an opponent that has more enemies. It helped V and AMber tremendously.
King Lord	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#93	[-]
Posts: 340 (03/27/07 11:08 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Alright, I've thought it over now, and I've finally decided my most overrated winner. I don't think anyone can change my mind on this one: SANDRA Let me say this first: I liked her personality, and I found her very entertaining. In fact, if personality was the only factor, she'd be my favorite winner ever. But that doesn't change the fact that Sandra played one of the crappiest winning games ever. I'll break it down point by point: 1. Her social game sucked -- As a viewer, I liked her upfront, in-your-face nature and found it refreshing. But I'll be the first to say that alienating everyone except Rupert and Christa wasn't smart socially. And it wasn't very smart strategically, either; since everyone knew she was so close to her allies, plotting against them was easier, which leads me to my second point-- 2. Her strategic game sucked -- As others on this thread have pointed out, "anyone but me" is an obvious stance given the parameters of game. The mark of a true strategist is actually controlling the person other than yourself that goes home, and Sandra did this exactly once: the F5 boot, when she lied to Jon about voting out Lill. Before that, she was blindsided twice, and even at F4 she just followed Jon's lead. Yes, I know Sandra tried to form a counter-alliance at F7, but she failed to execute. Allowing Tijuana to overhear Jon and Burton was a good move, but Sandra didn't follow through. Also, yes, I know no one ever targeted her, but that was only because she wasn't a challenge threat and had nothing to do with her strategy, or lack thereof. Sandra herself even has said that luck played a major role in her win. 3. Lill handed her the money -- whether Lill took Sandra to finals because she geniunely thought she could beat her or because she didn't want to allow Jon to win is irrelevant. The point is Lill made her decision of her own volition; Sandra certainly never gave Lill a compelling reason to be loyal to her. In fact, she treated Lill like crap most of the time, especially after the F8 reward. 4. Sandra gave one of the worst winning jury performances -- It wasn't THE worst (not as bad as Amber's or Danni's, for example), but it wasn't the best, either. She never once mentioned the strongest argument for her win: that Lill was an Outcast and undeserving. Sandra said in post-show interviews that the thought never even crossed her mind! Sandra also answered Tijuana's question in such a way as to make T change her vote. Granted, the jury was stacked against Lill, and Sandra was honest for the most part, but it still wasn't the absolute best Sandra could have done. There you have it. All the main reasons that I have decided, once and for all, that SANDRA is the MOST. OVERRATED. WINNER. This opinion will not change.
SurvivorSurvivorSurvivor	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#94	[-]
Posts: 6459 (03/27/07 11:24 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* Sorry people, but the fact is, Aras didn't do shit to win. He demonstrated about as great a knowledge of the game of Survivor as Sean Kenniff. He lucked out incredibly by not doing anything. But he stopped Terry. Stopped Terry! The man is a legend around these parts. Of course, the rest of the Survivor audience hates him for it. Really though, you can't include Aras as overrated or underrated because he really is neither around here. I never see him listed with the best or too often with the worst. His game is also readily apparent and NOT open to debate. He played extremely well as Team Leader, pulling the misfit tribe to the merge by a healthy margin. He then managed to blind them enough to vote out Courtney and Shane before ever thinking of pointing the arrows in his direction. Then, of course, he made a huge bonehead move by voting with Cirie. So, in effect, we have a player whose good qualities can't be ignored and whose huge mistake can't either. He shouldn't be first or last in anyone's list.
sunsawed	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#95	[-]
Posts: 8227 (03/28/07 2:51 AM) MESS SPECtrometer Emeritus Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* Brian will still beat Jan and Ted. I stand by it. THAT's why I rate Brian as overrated. He could have beaten Jan, Ted, Helen OR Clay. But he CHOSE Clay as the EASIEST path and nearly LOST to him. WHY? Because he wanted to win IN STYLE. He wanted to FOOL everyone. He wanted to rub in everyone's faces how superior he was to everyone else. If he had simply honored his F2 commitment to Ted, he would have won 7-0. His transparent backstabbing lost him 3 Sook Jai votes. Tom honored his alliance to Ian. Yul honored his alliance to Ozzy. In doing so, they won not just with style, but with HONOR. They honored their alliances by showing their worthy opponents exactly what they must do to beat them and accepting the threat they posed. Brian shat all over his allies just to prove he could.
craig	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#96	[-]
Posts: 16639 (03/28/07 3:30 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* If Shane would vote Danielle (who he absolutely positively despised) over Aras, then he'd definately vote Cirie over Aras. End of discussion. Not so fast. Shane's vote was all about punishing allies who betrayed him, and Aras\Cirie were partners in crime in this regard. That's very clear in his post-show interviews. Yes he considered DDL lazy and a princess, but she didn't stab him in the back. Thus we can't definitively call his vote in an Aras vs Cirie situation, leaving the outcome in doubt.
finishthemoff	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#97	[-]
Posts: 15489 (03/28/07 3:56 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Thank you, Craig, for pointing it out! In a way, I think Shane resented Cirie even more than Aras for playing mother card a bit too much and would have vote for Aras. He made it clear that he think Cirie is no good. Ted would have been Brian's really big goat. I concur, but who knows how Ted would have done in the last challenge?
chapera rocks	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#98	[-]
Posts: 12205 (03/28/07 5:43 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* nope, Jan was gonna vote for him no matter what. I'm sure Jan would have voted for Helen or Ted over Brian. She thought he was a slime-ball, but voted for him because Clay was lazy.
Ms Logic	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#99	[-]
Posts: 6 (03/28/07 6:21 AM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I also choose BRIAN as the most overrated. Mostly Mr. Cool Hand was just dealt a lucky set of cards and wound up with a group of morons on his tribe. He said follow, so they did. Had he been tribed with a person of even a tiny bit of brains, he probably would have had a rough go of it. Most underated: Jenna. Really.
RobVanStratus	Re: Most Overrated/Underrated Winner	#100	[-]
Posts: 9567 (03/28/07 9:09 AM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	*Quote:* THAT's why I rate Brian as overrated. He could have beaten Jan, Ted, Helen OR Clay. But he CHOSE Clay as the EASIEST path and nearly LOST to him. And Richard had a F2 plan with Rudy, expecting Rudy to take him to the finals, where he'd be slaughtered. He didn't have a good goat to bring to the F2, he lucked into Kelly winning Immunity and making herself the goat + having jurors who wouldn't reward someone who was a river rafting guide beat them. That argument is utter garbage. Tina chose Colby from the beginning and nearly lost to him. Vee got Neleh to choose her and she nearly lost to Neleh. Brian played a fantastic game and the fact is he secured the 4 votes to win at any means necessary. Playing up the "He only won by a vote" argument means you better bring it up against other 4-3 vote wins.

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