S-19 Edgic (editing and logic)

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rioothello		#2601	[-]
Posts: 29 (11/07/09 4:37 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	BlakeB717 wrote: I am just annoyed that you said I said Mick had a great episode, which I didn't. Especially when I've said the exact opposite numerous times: that Mick's episode WASN'T great; but for his winner chances it doesn't hurt him nearly as much as everyone else is suggesting it does. You DO act like a douche when somebody doesn't agree with you(like she said) and think only YOUR decision is right.
OnlyTheHunter		#2602	[-]
Posts: 2052 (11/07/09 4:39 PM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Phoenix, I'm sending you my old decoder ring...wow. Michael
Phoenix1269		#2603	[-]
Posts: 746 (11/07/09 4:42 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	OnlyTheHunter wrote: - Like to have people go over Jaison's entire edit. Numbers aren't a problem. Was the quantity of the quitting angle a death knell for him? Was it to keep "poor pitiful Foa Foa" as an issue to surprise the viewer at the merge? And my biggest issue with him, is he an OTT character in definition? Hey OTH... missed ya! I would love to see more discussion about Jaison's edit also.... As a mostly casual viewer this year... one of the most interesting things about Jaison is that in many ways he has always been included when really "anyone" could do. For example. In E1 (he was given a UTR2 i believe - i thought he was a MOR).... when they showed Russell's sabotaging... the editors focused specifically on a couple of instances.... dumping the water and burning the socks.... only the burning socks had any fruition. Immediately, we hear from Jaison saying he can't find his socks and that he is really cold. in later episodes, we hear from Jaison, complete with his white pruny hands and feet, talking about how difficult the game is (and him even questioning why he was there and thinking it was a mistake). We see through Jasion that this is a hard game. Mother Nature and Competitors. we also hear from him at one of the TC 's talking about the training he had and how surprised he is at how difficult the game is. He thought he was prepared. This is a lot of focus (unnecessary focus?) on some one who is struggling with the game.... mentally, morally, physically, emotionally... Contrast this to Russell and his E1 comments on proving how easy the game is, and then later during the monsoon how it pumps him up (more "easy" game stuff). In my personal opinion.... i think this is significant. MB & Co do not want people to think the game is easy. In fact, the majority of players and winners have commented on how hard it is. If this is a season of how Russell loses (which i do believe to be true).... then isn't it possible that the editors chose to showcase the winner working through all the difficulties... including his own doubts about the game and why he is there... If the winner needs to be painted as someone who has to overcome so much to win and for the editors to demonstrate that winning is NOT easy.... then editors have surely painted Jaison with that brush.... ETA: thanks for the decoder ring.... i'll put it on my mantle.... ETA2: scepticA... i just read your posts regarding Jaison, and i loved them.... I see that we are on similar pages with that. I don't know if Jaison wins, but i think it is more likely than either Russell or Mick at this point. I think That MB would love to show a true redemption arc winner.... i don't think we have ever had that before... Last Edited By: Phoenix1269 11/07/09 4:54 PM. Edited 1 times.
OnlyTheHunter		#2604	[-]
Posts: 2053 (11/07/09 4:57 PM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Okay. Now let's hit on somtething else. This is for everyone to consider. I'm looking for some exposition as I work out my own thoughts. Is there anything you read into the editing decision to add comments (from Shambo, Kelly, others) that kicked Russell Swan as a poor, or at least questionable, leader, despite both Galu's dominance and his angel like departure, and concurrently remove any comments about Mick's leadership in nearly any type of light despite Foa Foa's awful showing? It's not like it was never mentioned (the unworn necklace) but is it: A - A case of keeping Foa Foa as a tribe (and NOT Mick as an individual character) the ones to root for after the merge only. B - A case of keeping Mick free of the "bad leader" taint, the quitter Jaison taint, and from Russell sweeping negative statements at selected times? C - A case of no players saying anything about Mick's leadership at any time. D - A case of neglect, Mick isn't important to the endgame so it wasn't important. E - Insert your own ideas here. Michael Last Edited By: OnlyTheHunter 11/07/09 5:00 PM. Edited 1 times.
BlakeB717		#2605	[-]
Posts: 2119 (11/07/09 4:58 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Phoenix1269 wrote: unapproved, revised guidelines (from S17 & S18) Please note that these are not the official guidelines for this year... they are proposed only. The structure was designed specifically for easier comparison and some areas have been expanded (ie like INV) or cleaned up to allow for a clearer understanding of what is intended. Click here if you wish to read the original post and those that followed. There are some aspects that are very helpful here, though, including what is meant by "UNUSUAL FOCUS" and the expanded definition of INV. The Structure... to facilitate comparing apples to apples each RATING was restructured in the same way, as follows: Definition of how that edit would appear in an EPISODE. The key points: 1) the type or quality of speech 2) the type or quality of screen time 3) their story or "role" 4) SPV 5) complexity within the episode Notes -- Definition of terms: Special or Unusual Focus... - a substantive verbal exchange with Probst or being "highlighted" in some way such as a replay or where where verbal exchanges are subtitled. eg. Bob & Probst's "diamond in the rough" exchange during the E4 pick 'em; JT's Tooth; Parvarti's fat lip. Significant SPV... - where the SPV is part of the character development of a player or where it is regarding relationships and alliances. - not generic SPV like "Susie got treemail" or "Randy smells today"; or someone listing off a bunch of names. Challenge Focus... - being "highlighted" by Probst during the challenge as opposed to being simply mentioned once. - where actions are "replayed" for the audience. eg. Ken beating Bob in the E3 puzzle IC; Matty outlasting Bob in the endurance IC; or Randy scoring ALL three goals in the water polo IC. Note: A single mention of "X scored!" or "X is doing nothing" is not enough to escape the INV unless is was repeated ("highlighted") numerous times during the challenge, caused a fight or was talked about back at camp / in a confessional, etc. -- RATINGS INV - Invisible Definition: A character, within the episode, that is edited to be irrelevant or insignificant to any of the stories. In terms of story... they don't have one. The character... had no confessionals or tribal council questions. was ignored, lacking even in screen/face time; receives NO SPECIAL FOCUS during group exchanges such as intros, pick-ems and challenges was portrayed as irrelevant to the episode or story and/or is lacking in any character development. received NO IMPORTANT OR SIGNIFICANT SPV from other players Note: If the character received even one confessional or TCQ at any point in the episode, they are "saved" from an INV. --- UTR - Under the Radar Definition: A character, within the episode, that is edited to be either under-utilized or deliberately hidden (the trick is figuring out which). In story terms, they have a role in the story but are being kept out of focus. The character... had low speaking time and / or low content; they may have had a confessional and/or a TC question and/or was involved in camp discussions may have received significant face time / screen time, but isn't seen doing or saying anything special or of major significance; may have had limited screen and little-to-no speaking time BUT receives UNUSUAL or extensive focus during group exchanges like pick'ems, intros, or (possibly) challenges (ie. where verbal exchanges are subtitled; actions are "replayed" for the audience; or the scene is overly-emphasized by Probst) will likely have had some sort of "role" or part in the episode, but will generally be void of direct conflicts and/or character insight. may have had limited screen and little-to-no speaking time BUT received SPV from another player(s) Note: Since showcasing players who do nothing isn't very entertaining, UTR edits do tend toward low visibility, but that isn't a rule, only a generalization. -- CP - Complex Personality Definition: A character, within the episode, that emerges as a "personality" that is well-rounded and well-developed (intellectually, emotionally, personally and strategic/game-wise). The editing has depth, we see their strengths and weaknesses, and their choices are presented to the audience so that we get an insight into their thinking. In terms of story, these characters usually end up being major players in the story (game) and their choices end up shaping the overall, long-term story. The character... had a few-to-several QUALITY confessionals and/or TC questions and/or camp discussions; Confessionals and other discussions showed awareness and a complexity of thought about the game and strategic maneuvering AS WELL AS other complex emotions (like remorse, loneliness, guilt or betrayal) or an internal conflict over a situation. Their thinking process and how these feelings/thoughts/events are affecting them and their game (ie. positively or negatively, successful or not, etc) are expressed intelligently and maturely, as opposed to an irrational outburst ("You're a Liar, T!"). received moderate to significant QUALITY screen/face time, does something notable or important, and was given the opportunity to "talk" about it and showed their thinking process, choices, etc. (ie someone demonstrates a complex strategy or bold strategic move and we see their reasoning for it); may have had UNUSUAL FOCUS during group encounters AND they got to comment on it later. had a fairly significant "role" or part in the episode, and that role is part of the driving force of the story. The story for the episode "revolved" around this character, at least partially. most likely received SPV from another player(s). may very well have moments of OTT (or even UTR) within a single episode since being well-rounded and complex would, by definition, include being obtuse, one-note or single-minded Note: Winners are usually portrayed as CP at several points in the overall story since the story needs to be about them. However, this may not be the case in the early episodes if the winner starts out with a purposeful strategy of UTR. CPs after the merge are common / expected for the winner. A second note: Strategy alone does not equal CP; there needs to be something to back up the strategy. -- MOR - Middle of the Road Definition: A character, within the episode, that says and does more than a UTR edit, but is lacking in character development (ie. we still don't know anything about them or what makes them tick). MOR edits are not oversimplified into OTT nor are they well-rounded into CP. In terms of story, these characters tend towards being a supporting character, the "narrator" or the "survivor is great" commentator. They can be described as being somewhat "bland" or "just sort of there". This edit may contain "very strategic" moments, but without the emotional and intellectual insights necessary for a complex edit. The character... had some confessionals and/or TC questions and/or camp discussions; Confessionals and other discussions generally appear to be reporting or "fluffy" in nature; may have some strategy, but without the necessary thought processes / choices / internal conflict received moderate to significant screen/face time and may have done something notable, but overall, there was a lack in quality... ie. no obvious commentary on the action, no relevant background info, and/or no internal thought processes; May have received UNUSUAL FOCUS during group encounters, BUT this focus was likely linked to someone else and was used as a tool to shine light elsewhere. will likely have had some sort of "role" or part in the episode, but it was as a secondary or supporting role. ie. the immediate story DIDN'T particularly involve them, so they were just there; or the immediate story DID involve them, but this character couldn't "escape" inclusion in the story and we heard very little on their feelings/thoughts on the event; they feel like they are "on hold" may or may not have received SPV from another player(s). Note: Winners are often portrayed as MOR at some point in the story due to the necessity of cooling down, story-wise. However, a consistently MOR edit is not a good thing either, because these characters end up being "just kind of there". -- OTT - Over the Top Definition: A character, within the episode, that is over-simplified or presented as a one-dimensional, one-note caricature. In terms of story, these characters are usually used to create drama and to distract us from the winner. They are the ones we love to love (the hero, the sweetheart) or the ones we love to hate (the villain, the buffoon, the arrogant jerk, the right-royal-beyotch). The character... had a few-to-several confessionals and/or TC questions and/or camp discussions; confessionals and other discussions were generally one-sided, emotional and repetitive, without depth of thought or rationality expressed, lacked in strategy or strategy not expressed with much internal conflict (but probably had lots and lots of conflict with other people); Confessionals were used to "paint" the character into a certain type of cartoon-like role (like the evil villain twirling their mustache, etc) or other extreme behaviour such as no remorse for hurtful actions, focusing only on loyalty or saving one's own skin, an absence of "evil" strategizing when there should be, etc. received moderate to significant screen/face time and/or received a disproportionate amount of time during one or two events, where the focus of the screen-time was used to show the character repeating the same actions over and over; may have had UNUSUAL FOCUS during group encounters, BUT it was used to highlight the extremeness of the person or situation and the character didn't receive an opportunity to talk about it or to express themselves rationally. had a fairly moderate to significant "role" or part in the episode, often the "scene-stealer" or the "drama-maker" for the episode. The story for the episode "revolved" around this character, at least partially. most likely received SPV from other players; SPV was used to reinforce the OTTness and the SPV was extreme or underscored the actions of the player in question. WILL NOT have moments of depth or a "range of complexity" within a single episode. This is a one-dimension edit, and if the edit contains moments of "CP" then it is not OTT. Note: not all OTT players stay this way, and often an OTT player will go UTR for awhile if the editors want to bring them back to the main storyline as a more well-rounded character. Contrasting OTT edits in the same player (OTTN v. OTTP) generally mean a more complex edit over the course of the show. I just wanted to quote Phoenix's proposed guidelines since lots say the ones we officially have definitely are not up to date. A lot of criteria (specifically MOR) has lead to some unfortunate close call decisions, IMO because the guidelines we were referring to were very vague.
JT4ever		#2606	[-]
Posts: 383 (11/07/09 4:58 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Phoenix1269 wrote: when they showed Russell's sabotaging... the editors focused specifically on a couple of instances.... dumping the water and burning the socks.... only the burning socks had any fruition. I disagree. I'd argue the water dumping had much more significant fruition than the socks. The water dumping forced the tribe to boil water in the morning right before the challenge. And because of the time pressure, Marisa and Ben got into a huge fight over how long it was taking her to get the water boiled and cooled. This damaged Marisa's relationship with Ben even further and contributed to his vote against her. Compared to that, Jaison whinging about frigging socks is kind of trivial. Your other points are interesting.
scepticA		#2607	[-]
Posts: 1767 (11/07/09 5:03 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	JT, agree with your analysis of Jaison playing emotionally. Again, though, I was trying to figure out how he might win based on his edit. I was asking for other interpretations of his edit that might lead to justify his victory, not why he would lose. There's plenty there to reach that conclusion. People have put him reasonably re edgic, but most say he's not quite there. Based on the purity of essence of the edgic guidelines, he's actually not too shabby - t's when you get into his commentary and it's a big uh-oh. You've given a fine analysis of both RH and J, but not looking at how this might make sense for a Jaison victory. If you simply don't think it's possible, cool. Anyone else give it a whirl - show how Jaison's edit would make sense if he won?
BlakeB717		#2608	[-]
Posts: 2120 (11/07/09 5:04 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Again going to post Warrior's opening sequence transcript: INTRO Jeff: "Though they've not yet spoken, first impressions are all ready forming." Brett: "This lady with her free flowing Mohawk is probably some super outdoors woman that will naturally step forth as our leader." Shambo: "Dude, I'm a people (mad man?) (cut) People gravitate to me my entire life. It's like, Oh my God this chick rocks. We love her." Marisa: "There's a guy that looks tough as nails. He looks like a bit bull. He's like…I wouldn't want to mess with him that's for sure." Evil Russell: I plan on making it as miserable as possible. Making it hell for everybody (cut) to get what I want." Betsy: "When I first started being a police officer I believed every single person I meet, but now I don't believe anybody anymore." 20 strangers forced to live together while battling the elements and each other. They must learn to adapt or they'll be voted out In the end only one will remain to claim the million dollar prize. "39 days, 20 people, One Survivor" First confessional "Like, kind of like a deer in headlights (cut) taking on a leadership role in game like Survivor is a death wish." Second confessioanl "I do have leadership qualities. Being in the operating room you have to make some snap decisions. To get through med school you have to have more than a note from Mom and residency." Third confessional "My nickname has been Shambo since 86. I was in the United States Marine Corp and Rambo had the same bandana I had so everybody was like Shanon, Shambo, Rambo, Shambo. So that's my game name. That's what I'm here to do is to play." Forth Confessional "I really wasn't really surprised that I wasn't written down as the leader. But I really don't see anybody else as a country boy. I've shot and killed and cleaned just about everything that your allowed to in Missouri and probably a few things your not. So I've done all this stuff before and I think that a lot of these people are kinda candy asses." Fifth Confessional "I'm scared; this leadership thing can go south real quick. The highest nail definitely get pounded down in this game and right now I'm like SKY HIGH." The winner will be shown in this opening sequence.
BlakeB717		#2609	[-]
Posts: 2121 (11/07/09 5:07 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	I highly suggest everyone watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUZfET_xtPs&feature=PlayList&p=0EA037BBD8DF0821&index=13 It's the first scenes at camp for both tribes. The winner is always shown in the opening scenes of the tribe at camp in the first episode. Some very interesting things I never noticed before that make sense in hindsight.
WhoLetTheBlTCHout		#2610	[-]
Posts: 222 (11/07/09 5:17 PM) I don't take hints Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	BlakeB717 wrote: First confessional "Like, kind of like a deer in headlights (cut) taking on a leadership role in game like Survivor is a death wish." The winner will be shown in this opening sequence. Peace Blake : -) In a SERIOUS note: Didn't JT got his after the opening sequence? (correct me if I'm wrong) Last Edited By: WhoLetTheBlTCHout 11/07/09 5:19 PM. Edited 1 times.
JT4ever		#2611	[-]
Posts: 384 (11/07/09 5:22 PM) Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	scepticA wrote: Again, though, I was trying to figure out how he might win based on his edit. I was asking for other interpretations of his edit that might lead to justify his victory, not why he would lose. There's plenty there to reach that conclusion. Understood. I think Phoenix1269 has got you well covered. I personally think the knocks on Jaison's inflexible nature outweigh any possible "pushing through adversity" storyline, but then I was one of the folks who laughed and laughed at Stephen's "personal growth" FTC argument. So don't mind me.
BlakeB717		#2612	[-]
Posts: 2122 (11/07/09 5:26 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	WhoLetTheBlTCHout wrote: BlakeB717 wrote: First confessional "Like, kind of like a deer in headlights (cut) taking on a leadership role in game like Survivor is a death wish." The winner will be shown in this opening sequence. Peace Blake : -) In a SERIOUS note: Didn't JT got his after the opening sequence? (correct me if I'm wrong) Lol JT got his before the first commercial break (which is considered the opening sequence).
BlakeB717		#2613	[-]
Posts: 2123 (11/07/09 5:31 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Something to point out: I do acknowledge that Russ H has a good edit (in the sense of Todd: running the show and us seeing his story at high-visibility); HOWEVER, there are things (like my example below) that the editors would NOT show. The Katrina bit. The editors would not allow someone who used something like that to win the game. I guarentee you they could have cut that out (they also should have cut out a lot of nasty things he said for no reason, but they chose not to). They want us to respect his game and see that he's making moves, but they want us to hate him. I think there's been an interesting turn in the way editors show the winners since Micronesia ended. Being a liar and deceptive and backstabbing is not as honorable as being honest and playing with integrity and loyalty. Maybe it was because of how the personalities of Bob and JT compared, but it seemed like people are being praised for being honest and knocked for being devious (almost like being CPN is not as worthy as a MORP player). That's just something I've noted, but it probably won't amount to much for very long.
scepticA		#2614	[-]
Posts: 1768 (11/07/09 5:42 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	9RedWing19 wrote: What follows is episode number, Average V-Factor (=3 Visibility Rating), RussellH's V-Factor, and RussellH's Theoretical Visibility Rating 1, 20.3, 107, 15.8 2, 23.4, 94, 12.1 3, 25.5, 59, 6.9 4, 23.7, 30, 3.8 5, 21.5, 51, 7.1 6, 25.8, 51, 5.9 7, 21.2, 75, 10.6 8, 33.8, 116, 10.3 Total, 195.2, 583, 9.0 And judging from the preview, we'll get to see more of Russell in the next episode. Please try to contain your excitement. Is this analysis worth a Holy Crap or two? This is so off the wall from every other edit that whatever feeble grasp we all have of edgic seems even more tenuous. My big question is to the editors - is Russell that compelling a character, at the expense of so many others, to give him so much frigging air time? From my perspective as a fan, his schtick got old pretty quickly. He's brilliant, everyone else is dumb or a pawn. Okay, already. Someone mentioned that Eliza said that SEG is fully aware of edgic. Not surprising, given that we are for the most part uber-fans and they like to check out their fan base. But I think it stretches credulity to think that the producers of arguably the most influential TV show of the decade would alter their successful method solely to f##k up the musings of a couple of dozen survivor nerds here. Would that it would be so...
Phoenix1269		#2615	[-]
Posts: 747 (11/07/09 5:53 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	JT4ever wrote: Phoenix1269 wrote: when they showed Russell's sabotaging... the editors focused specifically on a couple of instances.... dumping the water and burning the socks.... only the burning socks had any fruition. I disagree. I'd argue the water dumping had much more significant fruition than the socks. The water dumping forced the tribe to boil water in the morning right before the challenge. And because of the time pressure, Marisa and Ben got into a huge fight over how long it was taking her to get the water boiled and cooled. This damaged Marisa's relationship with Ben even further and contributed to his vote against her. Compared to that, Jaison whinging about frigging socks is kind of trivial. Your other points are interesting. i had forgotten about Ben and Marisa's fight... however, looking again at the 2 sabotages that were focused on, it is interesting that 1 - the water - had an immediate reaction & consequence. Marisa got voted out due in large part to Ben's fighting with her.... and Ben earned himself a bad (justifiably) rap for it which ultimately led to his early departure. The other - the "socks" - has played out, somewhat directly and indirectly over several episodes.... but without a HUGE consequence like someone getting voted out or quitting (which in previous year, this set of circumstances would surely be leading up to). Interesting contrast, because surely if RussellH was busy sabatoging, he did much more than those 2 things.... like how many other socks and things did he burn!!! seriouslly though, just thinking outload, and trying tos ee what the editors intent was. I found this scene to be particularly interesting... thanks for reminding me about the water fight....
getting real		#2616	[-]
Posts: 1849 (11/07/09 5:54 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Anyone else give it a whirl - show how Jaison's edit would make sense if he won? Sorry, Scep. I'd love to try but Jaison is mortally wounded. Nothing that we can come up with could possibly incite a resurrection.
MasterDarkNinja		#2617	[-]
Posts: 2865 (11/07/09 6:09 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	OnlyTheHunter wrote: Okay. Now let's hit on somtething else. This is for everyone to consider. I'm looking for some exposition as I work out my own thoughts. Is there anything you read into the editing decision to add comments (from Shambo, Kelly, others) that kicked Russell Swan as a poor, or at least questionable, leader, despite both Galu's dominance and his angel like departure, and concurrently remove any comments about Mick's leadership in nearly any type of light despite Foa Foa's awful showing? It's not like it was never mentioned (the unworn necklace) but is it: A - A case of keeping Foa Foa as a tribe (and NOT Mick as an individual character) the ones to root for after the merge only. B - A case of keeping Mick free of the "bad leader" taint, the quitter Jaison taint, and from Russell sweeping negative statements at selected times? C - A case of no players saying anything about Mick's leadership at any time. D - A case of neglect, Mick isn't important to the endgame so it wasn't important. E - Insert your own ideas here. Michael I think it's more the way the editors tend to edit things, often if one tribe dominates and then blows a huge numbers advantage in the merge and none of them win the game, then that tribe gets very N editing. Russel being the leader made them have reason to show him, and therefore reason to give him a N, since none of Gelu has escaped an N or N by association. And then there's the fact that he did pick the pillows over the tarp, which was shown to be a dumb decision later with how much it was pouring like several days in a row that one episode. As for Mick, I'm not entirely sure, probably partially neglect, and maybe it just not fitting into the underdog Foa Foa story along with Russel being the strategic leader of Foa Foa, two leaders is too many for them if Mick and Russel wouldn't have conflict worth showing I guess.
getting real		#2618	[-]
Posts: 1850 (11/07/09 6:27 PM) Registered User Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	OTH asked Is there anything you read into the editing decision to add comments (from Shambo, Kelly, others) that kicked Russell Swan as a poor, or at least questionable, leader, despite both Galu's dominance and his angel like departure, and concurrently remove any comments about Mick's leadership in nearly any type of light despite Foa Foa's awful showing? My take is that it wasn't just Russell S. who was shown with question marks against his leadership. I think the question marks have been against all the males trying to take charge. Recall Shambo's early criticism of strong, male, dominant personalities not hearing each other. And recall how the males have been painted so far: Russell H: mean and bombastic; Ben: choose any appropriate adjective; Mick: almost irrelevant; Jaison: a quitter; RussellS: see your own comments above; all of the Galu men: fools who alienated Shambo and the women on their tribe and have paid/will pay for it. For all of the scrambling of the males in the merge episode, it was the women (Laura and Natalie in particular) who won the day. IMO, this season is being is edited, in MB's inimitable way, as another season where women overcome male bluster and come out on top.
OnlyTheHunter		#2619	[-]
Posts: 2054 (11/07/09 6:37 PM) Edgician Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	A fair response is that the warning of Shambo and Monica holds true, stepping up to the leader role is death. (This isn't Tom Westman's Palau.) Mick, in the position, made sure to hand it off. First to Ben, who was eaten early. Then we see Russell as the de facto leader. He'll be bitten in the end. Some woman will have a hand in it. But Mick (and technically Jaison I suppose) isn't in that danger. As you said, he's irrelevant now. That's not an example of male bluster at all. This is fun. Michael
BlakeB717		#2620	[-]
Posts: 2124 (11/07/09 6:39 PM) Registered user Reply Quote More Recent Posts Message Connection Block Invite	Remember: -If it's a male dominated season with many good male edits, a man wins. -If all the men have shitty edits and the women have somewhat decent edits, a woman wins.

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S-19 Edgic (editing and logic)

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