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Antithesys wrote:

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Why do I have to explain this every time?

The Earth slowly wobbles on its axis. As a result, where it's pointing on a certain day gradually changes over the course of many years. This is called precession of the equinoxes. Your "sign" is determined by the constellation the Sun was in on the day you were born. Over a thousand years ago, the Sun was leaving Cancer and entering Leo on July 23, as western astrology says. But due to precession, everything has shifted. On July 23 in the modern age, the Sun is just entering Cancer from Gemini. Nearly everyone alive today was actually born under the sign before they're told they were, because astrologers don't update the calendar to reflect precession.

That's a great bit of knowledge to display at parties. Especially when you actually have an astrology "expert" who explains all the rising and conjunction crap and sounds all smart and fails to take into account a simple fact of nature.

And I love to shoot down astronomy "experts" who try to sound all smart about how astrology is crap, but actually have no idea of what they're talking about.

You're confusing astrological signs with the constellations that represent them. Astrology isn't based upon magical rays coming from the stars; it's a study of cyclical patterns of history and how they affect people born at different times. The ancients who developed astrology didn't think of the stars and planets the way we do; the heavens were thought of a big, accurate clock. Interpretation of the signs of the zodiac was seasonal -- each sign of the zodiac was associated with the qualities that were experienced and observed during the corresponding time of the year. The ancient Greeks were well-aware of the precession of the equinoxes; however, because their system of astrology was based on the seasonal cycles, it didn't matter to them, nor does it matter to present day astrologers.

The ecliptic is a circle, and if you want to be able to identify something along a circle, you have to establish some sort of a reference point. The ancients began their year began with the spring equinox, and so it made sense to pick that point - that is, the point in the sky where the Sun appeared to be at the time of the Spring Equinox - as a reference point and then divide the ecliptic into 12 equal segments from there. At the time, the Spring equinox occurred when the Sun was in the band of the ecliptic that also included part of the Constellation of Aries. The first 30 degree division of the ecliptic was named "Aries", and the remaining 11 segments were likewise named after the well-known and easily-recognized constellations that roughly corresponded in sequence. The Greeks never used the actual constellations to measure the positions of the planets, however, because the constellations did not divide the ecliptic into equal segments.

So the astrological signs were created as a reference system to describe the location of planets in the sky. The 'fixed' stars (constellations) were just used as reference points. When we refer to "Venus in Aries" today, it refers to the position of Venus in the sky with respect to a well-known as easy to use reference system-- it doesn't matter that the constellations "behind" Venus have moved. You could just as easily say "Venus is at 10 degrees".

And if you want to have a contest of impressing smokin' hot chicks at parties, I'll gladly put my knowledge of astrology up against your knowledge about the precession of the equinoxes. . . .

Thanks. Apparently, I am also and annoying f.aggot.

I'm starting to feel like I fit in here. . . .